Totally fictional doomsdays

fadda eart — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 00:48:34 GMT

fictional doomsday, eh?
get this guy together with the clowns on Discovery Project Earth...it's the weirdest Sc-Fi I've ever seen...they're pitchin' fictional doomsday too!
Your guy can help with the bells and whistles...effects, etc...
laser light shows flicker and pop over saran wrapped glaciers...reflecting off Anthropogenic, salt seeded clouds...bouncing back to highlight all the little paratrooper trees.
There's some Sci-Fi for ya'll...and it's being peddled as for real.
heads up, Kids...

Totally fictional doomsdays

F. Torres — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 01:02:53 GMT

James P. Hogan - Thrice upon a time. Earth is destroyed Twice. Once by a swarm of microscopic black holes created by a fusion device, the second time by a plague. Both rewritten via a time machine. The sad part of the story isn't the billions that die but rather the two soulmates who just keep missing the connection in the rebooted timeline.

Totally fictional doomsdays

mark oconnor,winchester,ma — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 01:17:04 GMT

How about some non fiction.
When the first A bomb was tested the scientists didn't
know if the chain reaction would stop as a bomb or
keep going and consume the earth. Am I wrong?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Daniel Grotta, Newfoundland, PA — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 01:27:03 GMT

To this list of science fiction scenarios, one must add Jack McDevitt's Odyssey, which imagines a huge particle accelerator in space, about to replicate the Big Bang, which would destroy the universe if a secreative race of superior aliens hadn't interfered and blown the entire project up. A good yarn.

Daniel Grotta

Totally fictional doomsdays

James Tankersley Jr, Middleton WI — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 01:28:21 GMT

Hello Alan,

Science has always been a noble and respected profession with the goal of bettering society. Personal threats of any kind are not civilized.

Still, do you consider Professor Brian Cox a credible enough source on this when at the same time he is calling scientists with opposing views "t***s". At a minimum his comments are unprofessional and do not reflect well on he or CERN.

It seems someone should interview Frank Wilczek to get the facts on this one.

[ALAN ADDS: James, I'm hoping to get in touch with Frank Wilczek in the next week and ask him about the LHC and other matters. He's currently on a book tour, but he may be more reticent about speaking out now. Here's another report that quotes Wilczek:]

http://www.metrobostonnews.com/us/article/2008/09/09/03/5600-72/index.xml

Totally fictional doomsdays

David, Richmond, VA — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 01:38:04 GMT

No one will ever discover retrocausality. To believe that such a thing is possible is to misconstrue what time is. What will be discovered are mistakes in a fundamental premise which express themselves as retrocausality.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Dave Mosher, New York, NY — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 02:00:33 GMT

One of my somewhat recent favorites is "The Trigger" by Arthur C. Clarke (RIP) and Michael Kube-McDowell. Some people love it, others hate (especially gun enthusiasts and war supporters).

The characters try to develop an gravity machine that, well, unexpectedly detonates any explosives within a radius of the energy you pump into it... I won't offer any spoilers, but it's definitely a sci-fi thriller with hearty helpings of social commentary.

Pretty related to the particle physics theme, so I think a nice fit for this list :)

Totally fictional doomsdays

Charles E. Moran, Kingwood, Texas — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 02:20:35 GMT

While the hunt for the Higgs Boson is an admirable one and will advance mankind's knowledge, it is a theoretical particle. The Large Hadron Collider can theoretically find evidence of it. All this is well and good. What I find odd are absolute statements that nothing can go wrong with Black Holes or anything else when even the physicists are only proposing theories on what will happen in the search for the Higgs Boson and beyond. If I don't know what is going to happen with my experiment I certainly can't say what won't.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Van, Bloomington, Ill. — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 02:21:02 GMT

I don't suppose the LHC itself would have been considered "science fiction" a few years ago... A point to be made here is, no one knows how the first Big Bang occurred. What if its first moments required much less energy than we presume? What if it is possible to re-create a cataclysmic big bang, in this case accidentally? After all, we are getting into uncharted areas, and scientists have been known to make mistakes. Whatever the actual level of risk, I believe the CERN scientists are putting their egos and careers ahead of it.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Michael Noonan, Perth Australia — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 03:47:19 GMT

Actually there is mounting evidence that we do not know the nature of matter or of black holes. The really big ones in all parts of the universe and at every epoch don't grow beyond 10 billion solar masses. The ten galaxies around ours with a central black hole are the same mass. It is highly suggestive of repeating symmetries and the scientists did say they would have to stop and consider the validity of all the data if the universe was fractal in any way what so ever.

Enough of science I am not convinced the scientists would stop now even if it became clear the thing is dangerous. For one I hold the Bible as the greatest book ever written and it is very specific that wise men will look foolish before God's wisdom.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Frank, Dallas, TX — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 03:54:58 GMT

If the experiment works, it will not necessarily prove retrocasuality - however, it will prove something just as interesting - faster than light transmission of information. The way entanglement works in quantum mechanics means that one particle will transmit information backward in time to the point of origination, and then forwards in time to the other particle. An observer would see an instantaneous transmittal of information, but not before it happens. The neat thing is that this could be done across any distance, even an intergalatic one, if there was a practical way to put one-half of an entangled particle pair out that far, and if there was someone there who could share useful information that could be shared by the wave/particle duality... maybe by using some sort of morse code or binary language. Einstein was adamantly against "spooky action at a distance" but he was adamant about the cosmological constant too.

Totally fictional doomsdays

kevin, seattle, wa — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 04:02:09 GMT

Michael Noonan, Good suggestion for another science fiction book.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Mark Mitchell, Los Angeles, California — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 04:22:10 GMT

The scientist leading the hysteria is Professor Otto Rossler. At http://www.mathematik.tu-darmstadt.de/~bruhn/CommRoesslerPaper.html you will see his mathematics in black text, with critical comments by another scientist in blue text. Notice how Rossler states, in paragraph three, that the speed of light changes. This violates Einstein's theory of relativity, which has decades of experimental proof behind it. In fact, your GPS receiver is only accurate because scientists thoroughly understand relativity and can perfectly compensate for it. In summary, if you trust your GPS, then the world is safe.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Suzy McHale, Melbourne, Australia — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 06:27:00 GMT

Author Ray Hammond has a chapter extract online about a military black hole experiment - http://www.rayhammond.com/Brotherood%20of%20Angels%20Prologue.html - from a novel called "Brotherhood of Angels" - it doesn't seem to be published yet, though (disappointingly!).

Totally fictional doomsdays

CommonSenseScientist, Melbourne, Australia — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 06:35:41 GMT

"This violates Einstein's theory of relativity, which has decades of experimental proof behind it. In fact, your GPS receiver is only accurate because scientists thoroughly understand relativity and can perfectly compensate for it. In summary, if you trust your GPS, then the world is safe."

GPS is accurate about +/- 20 meters, by your logic that means scientists were +/- 20 meters accurate in their understanding of relativity. BTW, light has already been sped up beyond "the speed of light", by scientists, so what does that say about your "decades of experimental proof"?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Matt, Germany — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 08:08:44 GMT

I'm still nervous. Too many people trying to play God.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Dragana, Croatia, Europe — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 08:52:04 GMT

To Van, Bloomington: What is so wrong about daring to enter the uncharted areas? If humankind didn't have the currage and curiosity, we'd still be sitting in the caves waiting for the lightning to start the fire. I say, GO CERN!

Totally fictional doomsdays

steve smyth — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 09:10:02 GMT

hey Mark...most of those involved denied that they were really worried about the dreaded continuous chain reaction...however, as mentioned here earlier, Johnny von Neumann, the human calculator, who did all the numbers, was terrified.
film at 11...except it seems to have disappeared...there is film of this event with von Neumann cowering in the bunker...somewhere

Totally fictional doomsdays

pkraus — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 09:31:54 GMT

does someone know about the progress of J.Cramers experiment?
I cant find any Information about it

[ALAN ADDS: I did ask Professor Cramer about the status, and he said he's still trying to get the apparatus to work. It's a very delicate measurement, so it's not just a matter of flipping a switch and taking the data. It may be that quantum mechanics is conspiring against him. ;-) ]

Totally fictional doomsdays

Bob Estes, Somerville, MA — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 11:46:17 GMT

Rössler is the more vocal of the two scientists that have put forth doomsday scenarios in a somewhat scientific form. Neither of them has any expertise in the relevant fields; and their calculations have been shown to be worthless by people that really do have expertise. Rössler is a very eccentric fellow, to say the least. You can read more about him (and the LHC safety issue) in a post called "Large Hadron Collider: What’s the Risk?" at http://onscreen-scientist.com/?p=34.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Tom Nowell, Cheltenham, UK — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 11:46:19 GMT

Another good book featuring the subatomic universe: "Schild's ladder" by Greg Egan. An experiment into the nature of vacuum triggers off a change in the universe, as it turns out we were living in a false vacuum. In the opening chapters, people load digital copies of themselves into "femtomachines" (machines made of subatomic particles!) to try and figure out a solution in the few seconds they have before they are wiped out. The whole book has big ideas about the nature of space and life in general.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Robb, Tampa, Fl. — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 11:54:43 GMT

"Singularity" by Bill DeSmedt is a great listen (it's an audio book - http://www.podiobooks.com/title/singularity)

In this story, the Tunguska blast was actually caused by a micro black hole that hit the Earth and instead of exiting, is now orbiting inside. It's a spy / sci-fi / nerd novel with actual data and facts (interspersed with a little Jame's Bond silliness).

Totally fictional doomsdays

Bill Dauphin — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 12:43:09 GMT

Consider also Joe Haldeman's "The Forever Peace" (which is not, despite the title, a sequel to "The Forever War"), in which a group of scientists race to prove the space-based device they're working on *will* destroy the universe, and should be scrapped before it's activated.

For more-or-less *deliberate* messin' with the universe, see Orson Scott Card's Columbus novel (I think it was called something like "Pastwatch: The Redemption"), in which the world invents a time machine and uses it to go back and thwart Columbus, in order to preempt the European conquest of the Americas. This, of course, has the effect of wiping out the future from which the time travelers came! (I actually think Jared Diamond's analysis in "Guns, Germs, and Steel" demolishes the premise of Card's novel).

Totally fictional doomsdays

Bruce Gee — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 12:46:12 GMT

How about short stories? In "The World as we Know't" by Howard Waldrop, a Ben Franklin-ish scientist in the 18th century accidentally destroys the world when he tries to ignite phlogiston.

A possible moral is that, if you wait to do any experiment until you know with 100% certainty that it's safe, you simply don't have any science at all.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Andy, Kansas City, MO — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 13:05:13 GMT

People once thought that if you sailed out to sea, there was a risk that you would reach then end of the world and fall off into nothing. We later found that the world was round. People once thought that the sun was a god that rode a chariot of flame across the sky. We later found that it was a big ball of fire. And instead of the Earth being the center of our solar system... that god on his chariot of fire was. My point being, that when we are faced with the unknown we tend to make up an acceptable answer for it and follow that answer religiously. Science, explorers, and those unwilling to accept things as we assume them to be have consistently lead the way to our understanding of the way things really are. And the people who religiously believe in the make believe will always try convince others to help them prevent us from making progress. To scientist, explorers, and anyone who refuses to believe in what we assume is the truth, I thank you for my cell phone with GPS locator for 911 services, the internet which makes this conversation possible, and for continuing to push the limits of what we assume is the truth.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Ray, Clovis NM — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 13:12:17 GMT

The first black hole doom story I read was "Thrice Upon A Time" by James P. Hogan.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Andy Wilson — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 13:24:08 GMT

Nice to see that not all are forcasting doom and gloom!

Check out my blog post about the 'I survived the Large Hadron Collider Experiment' T-Shirt and continue spreading the word ;)

http://www.damnedifgodexists.com/blog/2008/09/08/will-you-survive-the-large-hadron-collider-experiment/

Totally fictional doomsdays

Nick — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 13:25:19 GMT

The scientific community have done a terrible job in reassuring and educating the public about what they are doing here. The amount of fear and worry going around at the moment is a shocking indication of how much the scientists have failed with this, and will only lead to a mistrust of scientists and of science in general.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Ray Edmonds, Slidell, LA — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 13:43:54 GMT

A better book to read is "The Guardian Projects" by James Herbert Edwards, this is really a great book
Ray

Totally fictional doomsdays

Kevin, Washington, DC — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 13:44:01 GMT

In "Hyperion" by Dan Simmons, Earth was destroyed by scientists creating a black hole and it swallowing the Earth. (Without spoiling too much about the series, this actually isn't what happened, but it's what everyone thinks happened.) It was called "the Big Mistake of '08".

I think it was published in 1989, predating Brin's "Earth".

Totally fictional doomsdays

bfwebster, Parker, CO — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 14:25:26 GMT

There's a Larry Niven short story from 1975, "The Hole Man" (won the Hugo), that involves murder and solar system destruction via a small black hole (cf. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hole_Man). ..bruce..

Totally fictional doomsdays

Mark C, Atlanta GA — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:03:03 GMT

*** GPS is accurate about +/- 20 meters, by your logic that means scientists were +/- 20 meters accurate in their understanding of relativity. BTW, light has already been sped up beyond "the speed of light", by scientists, so what does that say about your "decades of experimental proof"? ***

GPS's accuracy is limited by practical engineering issues, not any flaw in relativity.

None of the so-called superlunimal experiments violates relativity in any way. It only violates very unsophisticated popular "understanding" of it.

Totally fictional doomsdays

John Mack. Fairway, KS — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:05:15 GMT

Perhaps retrocausality is a byproduct of anti-time. Is there a chance that time, rather than being a dimension or property, is an actual thing, and, in much the same way there is anti-matter, there is also anti-time, and retrocausality is simply evidence of its existence?

Totally fictional doomsdays

JJ, Asheville NC — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:10:00 GMT

What all you self-appointed geniuses in this thread (and similar self-appointed geniuses all over the Internet) are ignorant of is that fact that the LHC won't do anything that hasn't been happening in the upper earth's atmosphere every second for billions of years, as high-energy cosmic rays collide with the atmosphere. In fact these natural collisions are even higher energy than the LHC ones.

The LHC experiments have occured naturally and are occuring naturally at this very instant -- just not somewhere with appropriate instruments to observe the results.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Robert, Blacksburg, VA — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:18:06 GMT

"James P. Hogan - Thrice upon a time. Earth is destroyed Twice. Once by a swarm of microscopic black holes created by a fusion device, the second time by a plague. Both rewritten via a time machine. The sad part of the story isn't the billions that die but rather the two soulmates who just keep missing the connection in the rebooted timeline."

Heh, I was going to post this and then saw it was the second comment! Glad to see someone else who's read this book. I enjoyed it myself.

Totally fictional doomsdays

For the Record, Houston, Texas — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:21:18 GMT

Black holes are not a material only phenomenon. They are a modification of space. The tiny "black holes" are theoretically expected to dissolve. Just in case this "dilution is the solution" theory fails, we must have public access to the following information.
- Precise location in space (not geographic coordinates)
- Projected paths of encountering these locations in the future.
- Tracked encounters with these locations.
- Interaction of these locations with other celestial objects. Particularly high mass-energy sources like the sun or stars.

Also, full disclosure of the intent of this experiment is necessary. If someone is planning to "mark" the space itself with some tiny reference dots to measure absolute motion of other objects and the location is picked to be within the projected path of the planet for ease of measurement; this is a really bad idea. We don't know the absolute motion of space and it may allow these points to travel through some very high "mass-energy" sources.

Totally fictional doomsdays

John Mack, Fairway, KS — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:23:26 GMT

To CommonSenseScientist and Mark Mitchell, Einstein's theories never deal with the actual velocity of light as some absolute value of miles/hour, only with the premise that nothing can travel faster than light. Scientists can slow the velocity of light through various medium down to slower than walking speed. As for the accuracy of GPS, the +/- 20 meters was the original accuracy that was available to the public. Originally, only the military had access to technology that could take full advantage of the incredible accuracy of GPS. At some point in the 1990's, Congress lifted that restriction so that private industry could develop products to utilize it. That is when the explosion of GPS technology occured, leading to the advent of Tom Tom and Garmin driving direction applications.

Totally fictional doomsdays

George Fedosuk, Hillsdale, MI — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:40:02 GMT

If I remember correctly Dan Simmons' book Hyperion (and its sequels) all have at their core the concept that artificial intelligences, in order to kickstart mankind's colonization of space, assist scientists in an experiment that unbeknownst to the scientists will create a black hole on earth.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Tim Rommes, Washington, UT — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 16:04:13 GMT

"CommonSence"Scientist,
If you weren't so cheap your GPS would be more accurate. With the willingness to buy better consumer equipment you can get within a centimeter. It's nice to see that your arguments are based on such solid facts.
On that note, I, and I'm quite sure many others, would be very interested in some information on that whole speeding light to faster than light thing. That's either very exciting or very fictional. I'm wondering if you checked these facts as well as you did the GPS thing.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Mike A., Royalton, MN — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 16:16:39 GMT

John Ringo's "Into the Looking Glass" Series:

"Into the Looking Glass"
"Vorpal Blade"
"Manxome Foe"
"Claws that Catch" (forthcoming)

Totally fictional doomsdays

Carl, Detroit, Michigan — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 16:18:24 GMT

Well, at least the post apocalyptic gear is here:

http://www.cafepress.com/hadroncollider

Totally fictional doomsdays

Gary-O — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 17:10:23 GMT

Well, lets see: the human race could end due to disease, famine, starvation, nuclear holocaust, warming/cooling, or from being consumed by a black hole. I'd choose black hole over the other options any day - it just sounds waaaaaaaay cooler.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Brenda, Chicago, IL — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 17:12:45 GMT

"GPS is accurate about +/- 20 meters, by your logic that means scientists were +/- 20 meters accurate in their understanding of relativity. BTW, light has already been sped up beyond "the speed of light", by scientists, so what does that say about your "decades of experimental proof"?"

I think you are probably thinking of Cherenkov radiation. The speed of light in a vacuum is a constant (299792458 m/sq. sec) and also the "speed limit" for the universe. However, through a medium (aka, not a vacuum), light itself travels more slowly. There are some kinds of radiation that travel through a particular medium faster than light travels through that same medium. This isn't a violation of relativity; only something traveling faster than the speed of light in a vacuum would violate it. Therefore, the decades of experimental proof remain secure.

As to the uncertainty in GPS readings, they don't necessarily imply a problem with relativity. Other quite likely possibilities include: eccentricities in the satellite's orbit causing variations in distance to earth and therefore signal transmit times; the satellite most likely corrects its clock at intervals and therefore the clock may be off by some tiny amount just prior to an update - take into account the large distances the signal travels this might factor into a 20m distance error; for liability reasons the GPS provider may just state some margin of error to prevent anyone from suing them whether or not they really expect the device to be off!

Bear in mind also that the Earth is around 40075000m in circumference...20m doesn't seem like all that large of an error in comparison, does it?

Hopefully you learned in science class that ALL measurements contain inherent uncertainty. Perfection is impossible, no matter how correct the theory. Reasonable margins of error are what we look for.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Max — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 18:02:10 GMT

Have you ever wondered why we don't see evidence of intelligent life out there? You don't suppose that life advances to the point they can build a super collider and then...

Totally fictional doomsdays

Duncan Frissell, New York, NY — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 18:11:25 GMT

Military SF writer John Ringo has a series starting with Into the Looking Glass http://www.webscription.net/p-232-into-the-looking-glass.aspx
"When a 60 kiloton nuclear explosion destroys the University of Central Florida, terrorism is the first suspect. But terrorists don't generally leave doorways to another world in their wake."

Boson generator creates gates which link Earth to unfortunate enemies.

Totally fictional doomsdays

JM Chicago, IL — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 18:47:44 GMT

More books...

Not SciFi, but ZOMBIES!

The Rising and its sequel City of the Dead by Brian Keene...a particle accelerator exposes another dimension filled with angry demons who take over the earth by turning us all into zombies. Not just any zombies...zombies that can shoot guns, drive cars, plan and strategize. FUN.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Albert, New York, NY — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 18:49:22 GMT

Rogue asteroids or comets are real and could one day destroy all life on Earth. But, that could happen today, a million years from now, or at anytime in between. The LHC? We'll find out soon enough.

The way I see it, if the scientists at the LHC are wrong about their calculations, and the world is destroyed, they will be the first to know.

There's some consolation to that. :-))

I'm all for it. If we survive, and I think our planet will be just fine, the LHC is going to open up new worlds of understanding into the nature of existence -- or not. That's the way science works. Even in failure, we learn something and advance our knowledge.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Generalit, Spokane WA — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 18:52:51 GMT

In James Hogan's "Thrice Upon a Time" only humanity is threatened by the plague. The Earth remains intact.

At the end of the story there is a hint that the soulmates will get together in the latest reset.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Joe Dees, Pensacola, Florida — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 19:28:48 GMT

Stephen King's story The Mist is based on a physics experiment that went awry, and opened up a channel between universes, which was taken advantage of by some very nasty creatures. A creepy movie was made of the same name, based on the story.

Totally fictional doomsdays

CommonSense Prophet — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 19:47:20 GMT

Nothing is funnier than listening to religious people try to use logic to defend their superstitions. I don't know jack about the bible, and I would surely not attempt to refer to it when defending the scientific method. Science proves its own legitimacy with results (the atom bomb DID work, and it DIDN'T blow up the world). Religion presupposes its own legitimacy by begging the question; god is omnipotent, he wrote the bible, the bible says god is omnipotent, so it's true (but you have to die before you get to see the proof!). You bible folks shouldn't clutter up such seamless logic (or lack thereof) by dabbling in things you can't comprehend, like GPS and black holes. Leave technical details to the people who show proof on their homework.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Lost in Dallas, Dallas, TX — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:03:20 GMT

All this needs is a frozen donkey wheel and Michael Emerson and you have this last season's finale of Lost

Totally fictional doomsdays

Martin H — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:05:57 GMT

I will have to add the Computer Game Half-Life to this list. An accident that create a "Resonance Cascade" ripping the fabric of space and allowing alien creatures to invade Earth through the tears. And to top it off the Hero of the story is a Theoretical Physisist, Gordon Freemann who is thrust into the role of pushing the invading aliens back and closing the rift.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Mica Haney, Manhattan Beach, Ca — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:13:29 GMT

look people, it's really simple. if we we're talking about doing something utterly unprecidented or unseen in the natural world like COLLIDING much heavier elemental particles other than photons or even at speeds greater than the speed of light, then...maybe we could discuss what we don't know & worry about trying to prove the safety of purely theoretical science.

unfortunately for the naysayers or those of less understanding, it is a widely known fact that much more energetic collisions occur all around us at all times. yet, oddly...we're still here...or are we?

c'mon people...the visible universe is made up of trillions of stars. stars emit photons at the speed of light. do you think, maybe, at some point...just a few of these photons might collide? if these photons are colliding at the speed of light (from both parties)...wouldn't that alone constitute exponentially more energy than colliding some photons at 98% the speed of light unto an inaminate set of particles?

i'm no genius...but this seems to makes sense to me.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Falseprophet — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:16:26 GMT

Hysterics are up in arms over the creation of black holes by the LHC. By theory, there must be two sides to a black hole. We know black holes exist. Are we on the inside or the "Other" side? How do we know that what we perceive as black holes haven't already swallowed our little portion of the universe, and we are merely peering through the portals created when we were all swallowed BY the black holes?

My point is, there are no absolutes in science or the arguments against it. There is no discovery without risk. Science has minimized these risks as much as possible with current understanding. If the world explodes, then the religious will be embarking on their final journey and the scientists will just be particles of matter in a void. What's to lose?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Archon — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:21:20 GMT

I recall reading, MANY years ago, a story in which a time-traveler drops a penlike tool from his own distant future. The tool had a field point that annihilated matter with no radiation byproduct--possibly a small captured black hole? This tool disappeared into the floor and, presumably, sank to the core. Later in the story the time-traveler visits *much* further in the future, and sees from orbit(?)a shrunken, wrinkled object that he realizes is the Earth with uncountable millennia of matter being annihilated by the tool he dropped.

My memory is fuzzy, this was over 30 years ago. Any help with a title/author?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Danthespace man — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:22:19 GMT

Ill take bets we wake up around the world, two weeks past the supercollider's first run and we find ourselves 10 min off and in a new solar system. I hope it doesn't hert!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Peter, San Francisco, CA — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:22:22 GMT

I love the CERN FAQ. One thing they note, which I have never heard before in the popular science literature, is that we are never likely to be able to produce antimatter any more efficiently, as it is tied to certain basic physical principles. Most pop sci I've seen treats it as a surmountable problem. Well, so much for the Enterprise. ;)

Totally fictional doomsdays

Vince Arcuri, Tampa, Florida — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:22:34 GMT

Here's why I k now time travel will never work... now or in the future: If it did or will, where is everyone? There's no one here wearing fashions from the year 2095. Unless they are standing in the dimensions we cannot see, then no one has returned back. Keep in mind, I love this stuff!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Hans Giebenrath, Calw, Germany — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:27:00 GMT

Has anybody heard sth about J.Cramers experiment? What is going on? I can't find any new information within the last half year.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Kevin — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:41:19 GMT

This might fit right in this list:

"Dark Matter" a movie that was never made.

http://www.simplyscripts.com/scripts/DarkMatter-Inthebeginning010405.pdf

Totally fictional doomsdays

Terry Brookman, St. Louis, Mo. — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:42:55 GMT

Puny human experiment on a subject that is carried out on a vastly larger scale minuet by minuet all around us. Perhaps we will learn something perhaps not as far as destroying the planet or creating a big or small bang, LOL

Totally fictional doomsdays

Dennis, California — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:44:25 GMT

Some day this planet will be struck by an asteroid, maybe a 2nd sun will come too close that is sister to ours. Besides killing ourselves by war, pollution and overpopulation we need to wake up and get along with most everyone, as well as continuing to advance as far as we can in all forms of scientific endeavor, otherwise what chance do we have to protect ourselves from a great catastrophic event. We could be doomed except for a small percentage of survivors, in a protected area like a cave.
As for all you book readers we appreciate your book knowledge, but this is not science fiction it is real and it means progress in some form. As for all the bible specialists, I still think the bible was written by a few scholars and put together with a lot of good stories based on their experiences and projected thoughts. Keep in mind all gains we have made in related fields to the scientific have come through many forms of testing, hard work, speculation, and people willing to take a chance. I am sure most of you are glad you are not in the dark ages, but some of you certainly still act like you are afraid of advancement, yet you are willing to benefit from it.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Terry Brookman, St. Louis, Mo. — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 20:52:40 GMT

Dread of some scientific experiment brought to you by the same people who do not believe in global warming, good luck!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Mark Johnson, Sonora, CA. — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 21:04:49 GMT

so if the scientists aren't sure how many dimensions there are, or how gravity interacts with these extra dimensions. What makes them so certain this experiment is safe? Shouldn't they be doing other experiments to determine the safety of this one? I mean let us assume a sub atomic black hole is created but it spans the other dimensions and doesn't just immediately disappear but hangs around. What then? Nuke the Russians?

Totally fictional doomsdays

John D. Oliver Fallbrook, CA — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 21:22:34 GMT

I don't see what all the fuss is about. The equation of our existance has no variables without experimentation. Do nothing and we're guaranteed the future identified by the signage "The End Is Near". Okay, so it's a few billion years away but if not now then when do we try to progress science? As far as I can tell the only people that should be concerned about destroying the planet and all of us on it should be those individuals that are certain where they'll end up.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Frank Glover, Rochester, NY — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 21:25:29 GMT

The best of all might be Larry Niven's:

"Rotating Cylinders and the Possibility of Global Causality Violation"

After the Frank Tipler paper of the same name.

http://news.larryniven.org/biblio/display.asp?key=124

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipler_cylinder

Totally fictional doomsdays

Darren Lichty, Pelican Rapids, MN — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 21:27:37 GMT

CommonSense Prophet
Read Genesis carefully, it is an accurate but brief description of creation without the modern scientific vocabulary. It does not contradict known scientific fact and that is miraculous in itself. Prove me wrong.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Silas Elmore, Kentuckey, Monticello — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 21:54:48 GMT

wow Flashfowerward is weird

Totally fictional doomsdays

A.G. Pym, Richland, WA — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:07:19 GMT

Regarding GPS: the commercial system is limited by government fiat to an accuracy of about 10 m. The system does broadcast another signal, used by the military, that brings the error down to about 10 cm. That's how GPS-guided munitions and devices are able to get shack hits from miles and miles away. The system _does_ take the extremely small time dialation effects caused by the relative motions of the satellites into account.

As for "speeding up light in a lab", it's been shown that what happened was that the *shape* of the light pulse changed, but the speed was still that of light in the medium of transmission.

Cerenkov radiation is radiation of a very particular energy level and wavelength which is given off by particles *attempting* to travel faster than the speed of light in a given medium. In water, anyway, it's a lovely, intense light blue color.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Spike MacPhee, Boston, Mass — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:50:40 GMT

Three more "black hole menaces earth" novels:
Greg Benford's Eater - an intelligent black hole arrives at earth with demands ...
David Brin's Earth - a power reactor's hole accidentally drops into earth.
Thomas Wren[pseud of Thomas T. Thomas]'s The Doomsday Effect - a small hole has impacted earth from space. Can it be removed?

All 3 are fun reads!
Paradox Olbers in Second Life

Totally fictional doomsdays

CommonSense Prophet — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:54:36 GMT

Darren Lichty: since you were there at Creation to confirm that Genesis is an "accurate description", I guess there's just no proving you wrong. You win.

But you might have a harder time convincing the Hindus, whose literature is far more ancient and more scientifically "accurate" than the Old Testament version you're reading. But undoubtedly you consider Hindus to be no better than godless heathens anyway, so who cares what they think.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Ryan, Rochester, NY — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:02:27 GMT

I really wish scientists had been able to push light faster than the speed of light. Wow, maybe there's a reason that it's called the speed of light. Anyway, if scientists had done that, then it would be theoretically possible to travel back in time. What a world we would be in.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Thomas Ashby, Calgary — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:07:17 GMT

There are physicists tha think time itself is a fiction. A convenient construct of the mind that says nothing about reality. This archive can be listened to with realplayer "Living on Oxford Time"

http://www.cbc.ca/ideas/features/living-on-oxford-time/

Totally fictional doomsdays

Thomas Ashby, Calgary — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:10:54 GMT

The first Star Trek series regularly introduced physical concepts that were relatively new such as ..anti-matter bombs, time travel using relativistic
means and relativistic physics in general. I guess with the likes of a Vulcan on the set, they had to !

Totally fictional doomsdays

JAMES STAUFFER Allentown PA. — Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:26:18 GMT

Yeah Right..like your so smart you spell God with a Small (g)?...Soo..i guess you still dont get it..?..The Bible says, [GOD,& CHRIST holds all things together]..and that was written before the word ATOM was even in our Vocabulary..Thats,why HE is the CREATOR.(((The BIBLE Has the Answer))),Read a little of GENESIS..then the First Words in the Book of JOHN in the New Testament,for MORE Insight & CORRECT Details & for the [EXaCT FORMULA]!,To the Universe and all Things THAt HE MADE,through CHRIST.NOT MAN..! This is Not a Good thing they are Doing! & what Good could it do us all..? Hey, remember the O ring on the NASA-Space Shuttle..?or the time all the Astronauts died in a fire even before it got off the ground? Hint, Why do you think they call this [DARK MATTER..?]MMMmmm. Maybe they should have called it the "DEATH STAR" Look,this Experiment serves No GOOD-purpose other than SELF & EGo & Foolish, Vain Guessing..HEY,.JESUS fed the Hungry & the Multiudes with only 5 fishes and Loaves..Let the boys,try that one..?or at least spend 14 million on some REAL NEEDS..WE HUMANS have.SCIENCE does,Not rule the Universe..Only-GOD DOES! so why play,God..when you cant even be Human or want to,Love & PROTECT all Life etc. on the Planet... including my Dog..? Hey, wake up! *THESE, Poor Dumb Guys who think there soooo.. smart* MAY ALL END UP..[FRENCH TOAST] & [SWISS CHEESE] DOWN IN THAT HOLE?] mmmm...anybody Hungry? Or it could all end up another [RUBBER BIGFOOT].? But,Seriously,May God,Watch Over Us & have Mercy on All of us,inspite of ourselves, Tommorrow! AMEN.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Remember this — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 00:51:31 GMT

Remember the movie-Event Horizon or watch it soon. It may give insight.Evil arrives after intense black hole power use.

Totally fictional doomsdays

S.DAVIS — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 01:33:09 GMT

Let's send a message out to the universe. Let it say "We here on Earth, will soon collide particles. If any Alien species believe this to be a death sentence for our time, and allow 100 years for an answer. This will give us time to try more nondestructive ways to To miss or mister common sense prophet. It was the bible that aided a scientist it calculating the path time tragetory of our earlier space probes. What is "Quantum" anyway. An attempt to make something up when you can't find the real answer.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Jesus Christ, your savior, jerusalem — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 01:46:57 GMT

people are'nt going to stop having sex because contraception has a 99% chance of working and there's the 1% chance that you get pregnant or an std, so why would the stop this, because the worlds at risk? no their egos are too huge to put the world before the experiment kind of like global warming people dont care because it isnt instantaneous, there fore they foreget and dont do anything putting it off to the future generations to fix or continue to f**k up.

they just wont do anything to stop it, to them theres not that big a risk.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Mark J. Dinkel — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 01:51:01 GMT

To quote A. Einstein "Technological progress is like an axe in the hands of a pathological criminal".

Totally fictional doomsdays

Aslinn Huntington WV — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 02:16:25 GMT

The CERN may very well end up being the underground Tower of Babel. Man proposes and God disposes. Even Einstein belived in God. Didn't he say something to the effect the God with out science is ignorance and science without God is stupidity.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Mark, Seattle, Wash. — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 02:24:54 GMT

You all remember that rockets were supposed to cause the atmosphere to leak out of the earth right?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Sarge, Ellsworth, ME — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 02:59:08 GMT

Don't mess with Mother Nature she might bite you in the butt Albert!

Totally fictional doomsdays

TG, Texas — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 03:11:31 GMT

Seize the night by Dean Koonz, while we're on the subject of multiple dimensions and weird freaky science going wrong!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Religious Scientist — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 03:49:55 GMT

I for one believe that nothing whatsoever will befall the Earth as a result of the LHC. If it turns out that I'm wrong and the Earth is gobbled up by a microscopic black hole (that somehow masses more than the entire solar system) then you have my permission to say "I told you so."

Oh, and who says religion and science have to be mutually self-exclusive?

Totally fictional doomsdays

marvin henry, houston, texas — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 04:06:33 GMT

in theory the only way we will ever see other worlds is by traveling through worm holes a type of controlled black hole we will never be able to travel at the speed of light otherwise. hope we are here tommorow i hope that are little experiment does not bring unwanted attention from other inteligence who are not even aware of are existence at the moment

Totally fictional doomsdays

Aaron Flentge, Cape Girardeau, Mo — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 04:17:11 GMT

Three Different Thoughts Come to Mind.

Those who are in favor of shutting down the CERN Collider should be made to wear a little pink flag on their back to shame them for their cowardice and fear mongering.

The world is round not flat. The only way to progress and solve the many crises in our near future is through our willingness to take the next step.

It seems most of the people in this world are too busy holding on to the bank of the river instead of flowing with it.

Totally fictional doomsdays

The B1G D@WG — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 04:40:22 GMT

12/21/12. You have been warned.

Totally fictional doomsdays

ep seattle wa — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 04:49:49 GMT

The human experiment will eventually destroy the planet anyway. So what is the big deal.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Suzy McHale — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 05:01:23 GMT

In the short story "Gravity’s Angel" by Tom Maddox, the Superconducting Synchrotron Collider was funded rather than canceled, and the end result is the creation of a singularity: http://www.dthomasmaddox.com/angel.html

Totally fictional doomsdays

Jeff Tucson, Arizona — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 05:03:39 GMT

Well holy crap i had no idea that so many people were smarter and more qualified to do such experements(or not do them)! Lets try to look at it this way, are any of us going to tell a heart surgeon how to coretly do a bypass? Are we going to tell an engineer how to construct a stable bridge, or a pilot how to fly a plane? No, because these people are professionals and have studied/ done the job before. So my question, why cant we let the professionals make the call on whether or not htis is safe considering they know far more about all of this than any of us ever will? The Earth is impacted billions of times per day with the very same particles that the LHC will be using, and at much greater speeds(the full speed of light rather than 98-99%). My point being even after billion of eyars of collisions the Earth, the solar system and even the galaxy remain intact. I am suprised people are so arrogant as to think that we can do something the cosmos havent already done. As for those religious zealots out there... why dont u pray to your god to save us? Surely he wont let his grand experement wipe itself out right? The simpel fact of the matter is that thus far the scientists have no evidence that any of these fears will occur, even the most wild and outlandish ones. As has been stated before if everyone was so afraid to push the limits and test our understanding of the world around us we would still be living in a cave. Havent you ALL benefited from the risks men like this take? I personally am no particle/theoretical physics major nor have I ever done any serious study of the topics. Therefore I am going to trust in those who are and have and just hope that they detect the Higg's Boson and prove the stabdard model correct!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Frank, Dallas, TX — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 05:11:21 GMT

How do they expect to measure the temporal existence of a black hole that small? Quantum theory suggests that a black hole created by the merging of two elementary particles would last only about as long as the Planck Time, that is, 10^-44 seconds, and the shortest period of time that has been directly measured in only the attosecond, 10^-18. Maybe they could measure the heat coming off them in the collider - a black hole that small should be very hot. The people freaked out about black holes swallowing up all of Earth need to have two critical points of ignorance addressed: 1. We probably have millions of black holes created every day when cosmic rays hit our upper atmosphere - but they exist so briefly that its as though they don't exist. 2. In order for a black hole to reach the point where it absorbs energy faster than it evaporates it, it has to be created with a starting mass of about 4.7x10^23 kilograms - about 6 and a half times the mass of Earth's moon. Since they are working with masses not even remotely on that scale, the Earth will survive.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Smith — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 05:41:41 GMT

The Mayans predicted the end of the world in the winter 2012. All they events leading to the event that will disrupt the balance of the universe is coming full circle. What now? Humans will ended up destroying the perfect balance and cause this earth to self destruct. HEED THE WARNING PEOPLE SOMETHINGS ARE JUST MEANT TO BE LEFT ALONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Smith — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 05:45:26 GMT

Totally fictional doomsdays

amy, melbourne, vic — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 06:02:36 GMT

how dare you scare most of the kids in the world because we all thought we were going to die today and know look what you have done because all the kids at some f the sckool are saying that we are going to die i don't really want to die so i hope you know what you are doing because i personley think thhat you are just a bit stupid and you even have to do it so yer i hope you know whatyou are doing.

thank you!!!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Cesar Fournier, New york, NY — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 06:07:22 GMT

I dont get this at all, people do crazy things in life thats making earth punish us for what we mankind are doing to ourself and as soon a scientist try to find good things they try to stop them, i guess thats why we are still living in a cage and making fire with sticks and rocks.. I say go CERN and finish it fast i cant wait to see if theres other dimensions out the and what the world and faith holds in store for us all..

Totally fictional doomsdays

Dragana, Croatia, Europe — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 07:20:22 GMT

I am not afraid of scientific experiments. I am terrified by people like James Stauffer. FYI James, KNOWLEDGE is one of our basic needs and we get it through sicence, not by reading fairytales! Once again, GO CERN!!!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Pieter pretorius, brits, south africa — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 07:38:43 GMT

Every one seems to b looking into the dread of night does no 1 see any good in these experiments if u lot think where we started with computers and where we are now. Give it time the race has just started not to long ago we were living on a flat earth then we were the centre of the universe who knows what the posebelitys could hold for us

Totally fictional doomsdays

Matt, Clarksville, TN — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 08:01:59 GMT

In the quantum world ANYTHING is possible but some scenarios are so unlikely to happen science considers them virtually zero. It's possible that the world would teleport into the sun for a few seconds and destroy all...chances are it will not happen. The threat of LHC generating a catastrophe of global proportions is one of these virtually zero percent chances. We were created to chase God. This is just one more step to understanding how the universe works and reading Gods mind...how is that not appealing???

Totally fictional doomsdays

Ramachandra Sakhadeo,Badlapur,Dist.Thane,India — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 09:38:04 GMT

If the scientists are unsure about the outcome and if there are no immediate/tangible benefits,why is the experiment being persisted with? Egos of these scientists do seem to justify the portrayal of a "Mad Scientist" as a villain in much of Science Fiction and the movies ! Even a small businessman conducts a Risk Analysis and decides against doing any thing if there are large areas of ignorance.What about the national governments that are financing the experiment? Are the politicians rendered dumb and deaf before the Scientific Community even though the outcome may go out of everybody's hands?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Josh Rom Davao, Philippines — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 10:51:20 GMT

Ill just hope that this people incharge of this project knows what they're doing cause once the damage is done-THERE'S NO TURNING BACK! we have to deal with all the consequences!
This is something serious! If it fails to do what it's suppose to, it won't be fun at all...

Totally fictional doomsdays

Syd — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 13:56:24 GMT

Good grief! I can't believe the number of references to MAN MADE novels and MAN MADE theories by the semi-informed that people are using here to cast doubt over these experiments, and yet they do not trust the very MEN who are learned enough to tell us not to worry. I pity the religious mind. It shall always live in fear and impede progress in the name of a fictitious God. Yet, when these very experiments create progress and new technologies, they will be first in line to experience them. Good luck with your pitiful existence.
Now if you'll excuse us, the brave must push on. FYI, the chances of humanity ending via an asteroid collision in the not too distant future are far greater than any dangers that the collider might throw up. If anything, the information gained from this experiment could help us counter any such collision. I'd rather die trying, than sit here waiting to be socked in the face. So, hang on to your stupid Mayan calendars (man made), Bibles (man made. No, really), and your other stupid prejudices. When we deflect the asteroid, we'll come get you from your steel bunkers.

Totally fictional doomsdays

AZ_UG_KING — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 15:38:38 GMT

Some really interesting quotes out there...By the time this whole fusion thing is going to be any good humans will be flying...im not talking in airplanes or cars that fly either...the human mind will be so advanced at this point that fusion wont be a factor or even needed...So why dont we take those 14 billion and make better schools better teachers...Also aint it strange that we can now do this things that space itself cant do...but we cant cure cancer or aids i can go on...but i mean even cancer cure would be nice...

Totally fictional doomsdays

Brian R. — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 16:23:33 GMT

I'm surprised no one remembers the 80's film from New Zealand, "The Quiet Earth". A physics experiment causes everyone on earth to vanish except those who died at the instance the "Effect" happened. The physicist responsible for the experiment survives because he tried to commit suicide that night.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Thomas Ashby, Calgary — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 17:03:39 GMT

Smith..winter 2012 you say? At least we'll see the next (and last) summer olympics in London.

Totally fictional doomsdays

NicM — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 17:23:26 GMT

OMG we survived! Should we get the doomsday folks out of their bunkers now or leave them in there for a while?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Barry U. Headinsand — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 17:30:05 GMT

The problem with retrocausality is that, since it works in reverse, it can only be "undiscovered".

BTW, retrocausality has already been possessed & subsequently undiscovered by ancient civilizations. The most obvious proofs for this are the great ancient monuments such as the Pyramids & Stonehenge. Ancient Egypto-Druidic scientists travelled forwards in time to an era when construction of these monuments was completed. They then simply took them apart (vastly easier than erecting them) and basically "ran the tape backwards" thereby constructing the monuments by producing a localized backwards flow of the spacetime continuum. The spatio-temporal mirroring that occurs during one of these backward flows can be seen in the temporary reversal of the Earth's magnetic field. As the field is currently decaying & projected to reverse again in the coming decades, we can soon expect to see the reappearance of the Egypto-Druidic scientists, moving backwards in time from our perspective, taking apart the Pyramids & Stonehenge before our very eyes.
I swear I am not making this up.

Totally fictional doomsdays

That Poor Dude — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 17:38:17 GMT

There is nothing humankind can do to destroy the Earth. My girlfriend would never grant permission, and I could never be that lucky. And as for anyone "playing God", I'm sure that if anyone gets close, they'll be getting a call from a skinny, angry, red-haired woman that has dibs on it. Ending the world would interrupt her constant tirade, and this woman tolerates no interruption, so have no fear. No mere super-collider can shut her up... but there's always hope...

Totally fictional doomsdays

Courtney Wesson, California — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 17:56:08 GMT

Well in months from now I hope you can calculate facts and prove your piont. In about four years we will find out what this machine will really do to us. Hopefully you guys (rich scientists) who put us all in any risk will not have anything to worry about.
*I pray for us who have no control and you too.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Mark J. Dinkel — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 19:53:23 GMT

A. Einstein: "If we knew what it was we were doing, it would not be called research, would it?"

Totally fictional doomsdays

Dave Conrad, Dearborn, Mich. — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 20:40:20 GMT

I don't know how to break it to you, but a test of the LHC actually did create a singularity which destroyed the Earth. Last week, in fact. As a result, this article was never published, and you're all dead right now. Please lie down and remain motionless, forever. Thank you for your cooperation.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Delmar Fairchild, Barron, WI — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 20:55:29 GMT

Alan:
Where can we find a pictorial representation or a good common sense un-scientifically babbled up discription of the make up of the atoms with the new particles in their proper positions? We are pretty much all aware of protons, electrons and neutrons, but where do all the particles fit in?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Delmar Fairchild, Barron, Wi — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 21:03:11 GMT

Alan: Other questions.
Can you find out what the difference is in the amount of energy used to send the particles around the LHC with the amount of energy released from the collision?

Or What cost is it to send the particles flying and how much heat energy does it produce when they collide?

Is there a possibility to send some type of particle at the speed of light to gain energy in the form of heat at collision time that could be abundant enough to be cost effective over the original cost of sending the particles?

Totally fictional doomsdays

allynh — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 22:08:12 GMT

I don't see what all the fuss is about, Black holes are impossible. Here is a great site that goes into detail.

The Black Hole, the Big Bang, and Modern Physics
http://www.sjcrothers.plasmaresources.com/index.html

If you can get past the math it's all fun stuff.

As always, read the links and make up your own mind.

Have fun.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Jason, Maysville, KY — Thu, 11 Sep 2008 01:40:17 GMT

Wow, I never would have thought the construction of a collider could cause such sensationalism and fear. It's just a collider, after all. The particulars of the science going on there are quite heavy, of course, but the basic concepts are easily grasped by anyone. Whip up some particles, bounce 'em together, and see what comes out of the soup. They're not making a Death Ray machine, or some new subatomic bomb, or any other such nonsensical pseudo-theory you might have heard.

Playing god? (Lowercase 'g' quite intentional.) Hardly. Just curious folks banging rocks together to see if there's a crystal inside. Amazing thing, curiosity. It's at the heart of every scientist, and probably most laymen as well. It's one of the defining attributes of humanity, and the source of all our collective achievements. Heck, you could even say that human curiosity about life, death and the origins of the universe led to the origins of first the traditional (i.e. tribal, pagan religions) and, much, much later, modern world religions. If people weren't curious about such things, there never would have been a social need for the creation of myths and legends to explain the world and man's role within it. I almost dread to say this (I don't want to offend anybody for their personal beliefs), but from a certain perspective, people 'play god' every time they recreate god or gods in an effort to provide some understanding of existence; belief creates truth for the believer, and in a very real way, that truth has reality, at least for that body of believers. Thus, regardless of whether any tangible evidence exists or not, societies create god, and believe in him fully. Society 'plays god' by creating a god, who in turn creates the world in which that society finds itself. Nevertheless, it is simple curiosity which drives those physicists, just as curiosity motivates all innovations, secular, religious, artistic.

If you want to argue the expenses of the LHC and how that money could have been spent differently, I invite you to look up for yourself just how much money is spent by companies in the US just in advertising alone. Or in frivalous lawsuits, corporate and domestic, based purely on avarice. Or in endless war zones across the globe. Or in the countless mind-robbing television shows designed to keep you stupid and confined to your couch every hour of your life. There's a mountain of money wasted every day; at least CERN's expenditures are a progressive way to spend it. If you want a cure for cancer, ask your local drug manufacturer why they waste so much cash on advertising, rather that spending it on R&D.

Totally fictional doomsdays

john gunnison co — Thu, 11 Sep 2008 04:58:02 GMT

anything to do with the earthquakes today

Totally fictional doomsdays

Andy, Toronto, Ontario — Thu, 11 Sep 2008 06:27:46 GMT

@ markoconnor

no, that is completely and utterly false... and quite stupid at that, right up there with that theory circulating a while ago that a plasma release from a fusion reactor would ignite the entire atmosphere and destroy the earth... absolutely no logic or scientific merit with these theories.

@ all the people who think this super collider poses any tangible threat, ytf would you be spending your last days on an internet board if you think the world is gonna end?

Totally fictional doomsdays

steinmentz1 Chicago Illinois — Thu, 11 Sep 2008 10:30:14 GMT

The Superconducting Supercolider in Texas
was 3/4 finished when the project was stoped
and now just sits there (waste of taxpayer's money).
Mabe someday it will be finished?
Good place to store Nuclear waste?
Many miles of concrete lined tunnels.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Van, Bloomington, Ill. — Thu, 11 Sep 2008 13:15:08 GMT

To Dragana, there is often nothing wrong about entering uncharted areas. But in the case of a scientific experiment, if there is any possibility of a global calamity, with the loss of billions of lives and all human history (however remote), shouldn't we all be concerned?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Adam, Ann Harbor, MI — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 00:44:47 GMT

commonsense profit....wow, your really ignorant, homework was done on the bible. Don't believe me. read the book 'the case for christ' by lee stroeble...lee an atheist none the less. facts are out there, just individuals like yourself take on an ignorant persona to justify your foolish thoughts. sad.

i personally think this whole artical and the 'big bang'...is nothing but a set-up for disaster. I agree with what Van from bloomington said. i ditto that.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Warrior Toronto Ontario — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 02:29:13 GMT

This universe is a Mystery & will be a Mystery forever, we can not explore or Solve this mystery but we can do one thing for sure, that is... we can realize & feel the oneness with this universe & become the universe in ourself......I hope I am making any sense to you all......

Totally fictional doomsdays

Dave Salem or — Sat, 13 Sep 2008 11:21:41 GMT

I think things all happen for a reason.There for go for it CRN. The basic understanding of time in my opionon is that we dont have one and never will.we can make anything work if we make up a formula for it. If we are going to be so intent on knowing every thing, when things are really proven to be so simple,Eat,sleep,drink,die? I guess i just like the simple life. I think its funny that we need all this stuff and knowladge to know what made us and to live. When there are civilizations that are undisturbed that have been thriving for thousands of year? Just an opionion.So blow it up or find out somthing new? It will probably just lead to more gadgits thtat give us cancer like everything else we make. LoL

Totally fictional doomsdays

incongruities — Thu, 18 Sep 2008 17:16:19 GMT

Robert Metzger's Picoverse
(http://www.amazon.com/Picoverse-Robert-Metzger/dp/0441008992)

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LEONARD — Sat, 20 Sep 2008 15:15:19 GMT

stop playing god do we really need to know about the big bang that much 6 to 10 billlion dollars why is people play with my world our world we have so many things wrong in the world with out ading more i think it should be stopped before do something they can t fix there are more things we can do with that money and STOP STOP PLAYING GOD

Totally fictional doomsdays

John Doe, Seattle WA — Sun, 21 Sep 2008 00:07:04 GMT

Can't wait for 'The Day the LHC Destoryed the World' film! Wonder how BradGelina will save us from the Black Holes and Strangelets (you know Hollywood will create some Black Hole-Strangelet-Monopole monster that roars like a lion!) The Special Effects should be fabulous! I wonder who they'll get to play as the the 'evil' scientist who turns on the switch? George Clooney?!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Scott S. Sacramento — Tue, 23 Sep 2008 20:35:06 GMT

If cosmic rays produce more intense collisions, why not study them instead of spending billions of dollars on this device?

Totally fictional doomsdays

S.Davis — Thu, 25 Sep 2008 18:18:40 GMT

Interesting that "sailing off the end of the world" if it were flat would have only extinguished those on the boat. But colliding particle that could, may or might kill everyone is far different. Be brave to kill yourself? Be smart and do not worry about finding the answer to the question, "Where do we come from" Believe what you like but do not spoil life for everyone else (MAYBE) on a hunch. THANKS to all the brave souls before us. We still haven't learned much.

Totally fictional doomsdays

greg, bellingham, wa — Thu, 25 Sep 2008 21:30:55 GMT

Are you really all that scared?
First of all, I don't think anything bad is gonna happen from this particle accelerator, but if this is how we "go out" then so be it. I'm a happy guy with a good job and a family, but I know I'm gonna die someday. So gobbling up the entire world in a black hole is about as good a way to go as any.

I dunno, these end times prophecies just don't bug me:
- either they don't come true
- or they do.

Either way, it's kinda exciting. Of course, maybe I'm just ready to give up after living under the Bush regime for the last 8 years.

Totally fictional doomsdays

greg, bellingham, wa — Thu, 25 Sep 2008 21:32:42 GMT

"Well, lets see: the human race could end due to disease, famine, starvation, nuclear holocaust, warming/cooling, or from being consumed by a black hole. I'd choose black hole over the other options any day - it just sounds waaaaaaaay cooler."

My sentiments exactly!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Terry W. Brookman, Mo. — Sun, 28 Dec 2008 07:09:18 GMT

What we do is puny compared to what is going on all around us. We live in this little bio-sphere and play with stuff, some of the things may kill us. The people of Japan know this beyond a doubt. Most likely we will let some tricked out virus loose and if it does not get us all there will be new stories of the gods that flew and had great city's.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Waiting — Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:35:51 GMT

[LHC Elevator Music] "I don’t want to set the world on fire...I just want to start a flame in your heart...In my heart I have but one desire..And that one is you no other will do" -- Ink Spots

Totally fictional doomsdays

mike, albany, ny — Wed, 10 Jun 2009 15:39:17 GMT

We fear what we don't understand or can't comprehend. When the first locomotives and automobiles were being developed, experts from the medical community warned of imminent death or severe disability if the human body ever reached speeds exceeding 35 mph. I think they thought that it would be impossible to breathe and one would suffer from the lack of oxygen.
It sounds silly now, but they were quite serious at the time.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Gavin R, Colby, Kansas — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 20:35:00 GMT

Who comes up with these ignorant, doomsday scenarios and why? Let the one with the PhD's use their knowledge to determine the dangers of such experimants that have the potential to make fantastic discoveries. And above all, don't allow that ignorance to return us to the dark ages! I want humanity to continue to progress not regress!

Totally fictional doomsdays

M. Alden, Bakersfield, CA — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 23:51:53 GMT

CommonSense Prophet..."Science proves its own legitimacy with results (the atom bomb DID work, and it DIDN'T blow up the world).
Problem is, until they detonated it it was a split camp on if it would work as they hoped or if it would be an even greater destructive force than thought. As it turned out, neither camp was correct! It was a far greater destructive force than imagined by those who thought it would be safe, yet not a world destroyer. SO, while it did work, it did not work as either camp theorized, thus the debate about what to expect from the LHC.
Those involved with this experiment have a theory of what they expect will happen, yet they admit that until it happens it is just that...a theory! When one can not clearly state, with scientific proof, exactly what the outcome will be, none can state with any degree of certainty what will NOT happen.
I am all for scientific experimentation that may involve some risk, when there is a degree of certainty of the probable outcome. However, when you have other notable scientists who theorize that black holes may be created and the LHC scientists admitting that some may form, but will "likely" fizzle out, that is not very reassuring. As neither camp were right about what would "likely" happen with the atom bomb, can we afford for the LHC scientists to "likely" be mistaken?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Charles Smith, Venice, Fl. — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 00:46:33 GMT

How about? Science has finally mastered a space drive that can produce travel at any speed, from sub-light to anything you want above light speed. Now imagine you have left earth and traveled 100 light years away from earth. Just to see what will happen you slow your craft to exactly light speed. You train you sensors toward earth and find you are almost on top it and can actually land and interact with it physically. This seems to have some relativity to the other posts here. Will it fly?

Totally fictional doomsdays

john do, Seattle, Wash. — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 00:59:08 GMT

So what if we find a higs boson particle?
What'll happen next?

Totally fictional doomsdays

Charles Smith, Venice, Fl. — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 03:55:30 GMT

Elementary my dear Watson, you get 3 wishes.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Arp Schnitger, Brandon, MS — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 23:00:49 GMT

Mr. O'Connor, Oppenheimer asked the hypothetical question you allude to just before the A-bomb detonated on the tower. The question was whether or not the bomb might ignite the oxygen in the atmosphere. It didn't, obviously, but that disturbing notion didn't stop Oppenheimer, either. I don't think we have anything to worry about, but you never know . . . .

Totally fictional doomsdays

Kevin — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 23:35:30 GMT

Another end of the world scenario that will not happen. How many times does it take. You people are like children who like to scare themselves for entertainment. The lack of criticat thinking skills is appalling.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Joe Smith — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 01:32:54 GMT

They forgot THE QUIET EARTH - A scientist discovers that he is apparently the last person on earth when an experiment goes awry. One of the few modern science fiction films that isn't thirty years behind its literary counterparts.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Mick Jagger — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 04:11:28 GMT

Time, time, time, it's on my side. Yes it is!

Totally fictional doomsdays

Don Stockstill, Ozark, Missouri — Sun, 22 Nov 2009 01:01:57 GMT

Actually the speed of light is not the same everywhere. In space where there is no atmosphere light travels at approximtely 186,000 miles per second. However light travels at a somewhat slower speed in air or liquids. The index of refraction, n is the ratio of the speed of light in a medium to that of the speed of light in space. In other words, n= v/c. This is not a violation of the Einstein Theory of Relativity which simply states that the speed of light in space is the maximum speed that can be attained. It has been proposed for many years that there are particles called tacheyons which, if they exist, would travel faster than light, but their existence has yet to be confirmed.If such particles existed, it might be theoretically possible to travel into the past simply by overtaking light reflected from events that happened in the past. Who knows what science will discover and to what use those discoveries might be put? Regarding another posted comment, the scientists in the New Mexico desert were not sure what would happen when the switch was flipped to detonate the first atomic bomb on July 16, 1945. They figured that it was possible that the bomb could prove to be a dud, or maybe the explosion would ignite the atmosphere all over the world, thus eliminating all life on our planet.

Totally fictional doomsdays

Thomas Lee Boles, St. Paul, MN — Sun, 22 Nov 2009 02:39:15 GMT

There's Spider Robinson's "Callahan's Key," with a threat of beams colliding from a Soviet satellite,a Star Wars satellite, and a supernova. The Star Wars satellite is equipped with a death ray originally developed by Nikola Tesla, who is still alive and well at the age of 130+. On its first test this weapon caused the thirty megaton Tunguska Event of June 30, 1908. The danger is that the particle collision will recreate the Big Bang and end the current universe. The whole story is very much tongue-in-cheek--a good antidote to scaremongering.
(Note: The Tunguska Event was real, as are the Key deer we meet along the way.)

Totally fictional doomsdays

Larry — Mon, 23 Nov 2009 05:13:10 GMT

Geez Folks---Just Chill Out!