Messianic message stirs debate

Fritz — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 21:34:39 GMT

I don't know why this is such a bombshell. In the psalms of David the same concept is repeated with much more accuracy. A messiah will be crucified and will be resurected. It is the crux of the Messianic Jewish movement.

Messianic message stirs debate

Susan T San bernardino, Ca — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 21:34:56 GMT

Even if they prove that it is real...they will never be able to prove if it was written by a genuine prophet. I think this is a debate that will last forever.

Messianic message stirs debate

Todd B, Dallas Tx — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 21:42:16 GMT

if this was so important as to shake the foundations of religious belief, it would not be released or at least certain messages will be concealed.

Just as industry silenced the genious of nicholai tesla, to safeguard profits at the cost of humanity, the great business that is church would not let things shake the faith of their flock...

Messianic message stirs debate

roy roberts — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:00:49 GMT

even if one should rise from the dead they still will not believe!

Messianic message stirs debate

Lisa, Allen, Texas — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:14:51 GMT

"Finally, what impact would a pre-Christian reference to suffering, death and resurrection have on Christian scholarship?"

It shouldn't (and wouldn't) have any impact at all presuming that a Christian is following the teachings of the Bible. You can't just use the New Testament and discard the Old Testament. These earlier texts are rife with references to the "suffering Messiah" Who would be pierced and die for the world's transgressions and yet would rise again from the dead. Psalm 22 and many, many sections of the Book of Isaiah are loaded with these types of prophecies.

Messianic message stirs debate

ahmed zahmed, provo, ut — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:19:12 GMT

yawn

Messianic message stirs debate

Rick, Ohio — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:25:12 GMT

While I recognize the value of studies on the evolution of religion, I can't help but feel scriptural scholars are letting the world down. Hopefully more objective scholars will help the worlds peoples understand the mythical nature of their core beliefs, and render religious excuses for war moot. In the meantime, who do I vote for for president when both candidates profess a strong belief in religious lies?

Messianic message stirs debate

Daisy, AZ — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:35:59 GMT

This shouldn't be a surprise! We have been talking about Jesus for over 2,000 years ... How much proof does mankind want? We have the time and place. We We have the scrolls. We have the shroud. We have the book (Bible) Everything is being revealed as prophesied. We have the promise ... as it is said, there is none so blind as those who refuse to see.
God Bless

Messianic message stirs debate

Frank, Philadelphia — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:53:15 GMT

Christians and Catholics believe that Jesus was the fulfillment of quite a few previous Jewish prophecies found in the Bible. Jewish people believe Jesus was not the Messiah of prophecy. Honestly this will probably have little impact on what people in either religion believe, it will simply verify Christian belief in Jesus.

Messianic message stirs debate

steve laguna beach, ca — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:56:52 GMT

The christian religionist will never change the story, since they do so well on it. The masses can always be kept in the dark.

Messianic message stirs debate

J. MADISON — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:59:27 GMT

WRITEN IN INK ON STONE HUH?really?

Messianic message stirs debate

Pat Schenk, Leesburg, VA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:00:43 GMT

I look forward to Bill Moyers doing a segment on this for his PBS program Friday nights.

Messianic message stirs debate

Rosalie Payne, Godfrey, Il. — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:02:14 GMT

I'm a christian, I believe the bible to be the word of God. If any new discoveries deviate from Gods word, I believe the truth will come forth in time.

Messianic message stirs debate

j doe — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:03:46 GMT

I find it strange that someone with ink didn't have something else to write on. I'd carbon-date the ink.

Messianic message stirs debate

Essenes — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:05:21 GMT

It's a fraud concocted for political reasons, much like the Piltdown Man was a century ago.

Messianic message stirs debate

Mario Pires — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:06:53 GMT

Of course there is a linkage, pre-christians were jews.

Messianic message stirs debate

Andrew Stanfill, Gainesville, Florida — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:07:36 GMT

Thank you Alan for this excellent article compiling the discussions on this artifact. It will be very interesting to see if anything else can be gleamed from it.

Messianic message stirs debate

Brandon, Tucson, AZ — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:09:19 GMT

Really cool! It's amazing how many of the prophesies from the Old Testament that Jesus fulfilled, dates, locations, etc, I still can't believe how a practicing Jew couldn't believe that he IS the Messiah!??? But let's wait and see what happens, there were plenty of contemporaries of the time even then messing with history, (Gnostics, etc) I'm sure even on the other side someone could have theoretically done this to 'prove' everything...that's where faith comes in!

Messianic message stirs debate

Arlene Zier — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:09:50 GMT

I believe there will be many things yet to come to try to destroy the traditional belief of who Jesus was and is. There is much we do not know as well as much that we do know. I am at peace with myself and at peace with others.

Messianic message stirs debate

Regis — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:12:06 GMT

The desciples of Jesus knew of these Jewish prophecies and matched Jesus's death and resurrection story to the former, in effect creating misreading of Jesus's words and a distortion of the western view of jesus's message.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jude, Cambridge, MA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:12:47 GMT

"Finally, what impact would a pre-Christian reference to suffering, death and resurrection have on Christian scholarship?" I believe Mr. Boyle meant to say "does" not "would." Or better still "do such references." Scholars of New Testament and early Christianity have pretty much been aware (in a historical, cultural-critical way) of "pre-Christian reference[s] to suffering, death and resurrection" in ancient Mediterranean religions since at least the 17th Century. Indeed, the whole corpus of ancient Greek and Roman mythologies is replete with such references. So what's the big deal? Where's the story MSNBC? Honestly, coverage of religion in the popular media is just shamefully, scandalously shallow. Though it is getting better. At least they're reporting on it.

Messianic message stirs debate

Rachell Henderon, Nashville, TN — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:12:49 GMT

Why has it taken over a decade for us to hear about this?

Messianic message stirs debate

Found The Truth — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:13:28 GMT

This stuff with scrolls is nonsense, if you read the Quran and actually with out any bias try to understand Islam as I did , you will see Islam is the true religion.

Messianic message stirs debate

Craig Bloomingburg — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:13:45 GMT

The key word here is FAITH that says it all. This is just another testement of Jesus Christ being revieled in the last days so more people will accept Christ as there savior. We can ask all you want is it real or not but before long all these questions will be answared by Jesus himself coming back to take his loved ones home to be with hime forever.

Messianic message stirs debate

Rex A. Chinn, Maryland Heights, MO — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:13:45 GMT

There is always a thurst for explosive news, and a lot of news outlets will milk any possibility of something sensational. The repeated expectation that some new find will somehow shatter traditional understanding of things Biblical has, I believe, usually proven to be unfounded. While new finds sometimes add new insights, they tend to confirm rather than distroy clasical Biblical concepts. If this proves to be an authentic intertestament document, it will probably prove to add only a small weight to already existing concepts about the relationship between Jewish thought and Christianity. After all, Jesus was a Jew and was devoted to the Hebrew scriptures, which he understood to speak repeatedly of him.

Messianic message stirs debate

mark hodges — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:17:10 GMT

Why would Christians Scholars be shocked at Messianic prophecies predating the New Testament? The N.T. is full of references to Old Testamnet scriptures that were considered messianic to the Jews of that day. Christian scholars have been talking about Isaiah 53, Is. 9, and dozen of messianic prophecies from Genesis on four thousands of years....wow, its really hard to have any respect amy more for secular (atheistic) scholarship in any area of research any more... they must have been trained with their heads in a bucket...

Messianic message stirs debate

Brandon — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:17:27 GMT

Religion: same story, different version (Judaism, Christianity). Why even debate anymore?

Messianic message stirs debate

Arnold Swanberg — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:17:31 GMT

There is absolutely nothing new in this tablet because "Jewish scripture" such as the Old Testament book of Isaiah has always been used in Christian churches as a fortelling of the arrival of Jesus Christ. All this tablet does is confirm the Jewish prophesy of a messiah (whom) Christians believe was Jesus Christ and whom Jews think is someone else who has yet to show up.

Messianic message stirs debate

Bob, Yukon, Oklahoma — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:19:58 GMT

"You shall know me by the truth" and the truth is starting to shine. The Second Coming is on its way.

Messianic message stirs debate

Anna Walker. Anchorage — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:20:02 GMT

Amazing how we keep finding things lost to the centruies in places where so much of mankind started civilization. What it all shows is that we are all connected, stories pass, generation to generation and legends have their basis somewhere in the dark of time in fact.

Messianic message stirs debate

John, Las Vegas, NV — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:21:24 GMT

This is very interesting.
The story of Jesus isn't new though. We've already known the basic outline from numerous mythological figures in the past.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ed, Mt Vernon, WA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:22:20 GMT

This seems rather strange to me, that some think this something new?? The Bible book of Luke Ch 2 & 3:15 indicate the Jews were in expectation of the Christ, WHEN He appeared. They just didn't accept him. Even The Jewish Encyclopedia 1976, Vol 8, pg 508 indicates they were yearning for their deliverer of the line of David, to free them from Roman oppresion and establish his own reign of peace. Prophsies about Christ go all the way back to Genesis 3:15 as the one who would crush Satan.

Messianic message stirs debate

deedee — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:23:24 GMT

When is the bible going to be denounced for what it really is? a fairy tale

Messianic message stirs debate

Dave Redmond — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:24:00 GMT

There are so many Old Testament references to the coming Messiah, notably Psalm 22 and Isaiah 52 and 53, among others, it would not surprise me if there were other prophetic writings not included in the canon of scriptures. Christianity is already known to have its foundation in Judaism, and there are many parallels between the Old and New Testaments: The Passover and Feast of Unleavened Bread in remembrance of the deliverance from slavery in Egypt, and the Lord's Supper, a memorial of
Christ's death, with the deliverance of Christians from the penalty of sin, and the hope of a "promised land" in the hereafter.

Messianic message stirs debate

Al Irizarry, San Ysidro, CA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:24:41 GMT

It would be an interesting artifact. But Christians already have similar elements in the Book of Daniel and the prophecy of the 70 weeks (or periods of 7), where the death of the messiah and the offering of redemption is long foretold. The Old Testament is a Jewish writing, so this would just be an additional item and NOT the first.

Messianic message stirs debate

Diane Tosh-Ferrazzano — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:24:54 GMT

Nothing shocking here. It would be a very interesting archaeological find, if genuine. But, as a Christian, I'm fully aware of Judaism's Messianic Prophecies as are most Christians, (I should hope!) The Book of Isaiah very clearly describes The Messiah as The Suffering Servant. It is one of the books of the Jewish Prophets I hold closest to my heart!

Messianic message stirs debate

Aaron D - California — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:26:21 GMT

If shown to be authentic, it will contribute the the harmony already demonstrated in the bible. A crucial element that will inevitably decide a persons opinion on items like this is their faith. Not blind faith, but faith built on reliable evidences from early times on into the future (Heb 3:4). Those who depend on their own intellect alone will be unable to appreciate certain dimensions of life. (Heb 5:12;1 Cor 2:14)Bottom line? This will make little or no difference at all and will likely just be a source of much wasted energy and time when all along we have thousands of pages of the bible already in tact that most already ignore.

Messianic message stirs debate

Deb Jones, Augusta, Maine — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:26:28 GMT

I will be exalted when enough "evidence" for mankind exists to prove beyond proving that our Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ "exists". Can you imagine the world this could/should be IF mankind truly "knew" He existed?? I shudder to think.
Deb Jones, Augusta, ME

Messianic message stirs debate

John, Gilbert, AZ — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:28:42 GMT

Numerous stories in the Old Testament fortell of a Messiah. Abraham's near sacrifice of his son, the Jewish holiday of passover are both examples of such teachings.

This reaffirms my belief that Christ was prophesied of in the time of the Jews. Plain and simple.

-John

Messianic message stirs debate

CBob — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:30:59 GMT

What did Jesus say repeatedly, thematically? 'You search the scriptures (Hebrew) for life, and they point to me!'

Messianic message stirs debate

Erik, Seattle — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:31:17 GMT

I think both religions need to realize they are too old for fairy tales.

Messianic message stirs debate

D Pope, Utah — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:31:29 GMT

It does not matter if it is proven or not. People have not changed at all. The proof can be right in front of you and if you want to ignore it you will. The people of Moses saw the Red Sea parted in front of them, plus all of the other mericles that occured durring that time, and they still worshipped idols as Gods. Faith is more powerful than any other thing in the world. I have seen proof of many things in my life, and faith is the main factor in my belief. People will find a way to not believe in something by means of justification. If you don't have faith, no amount of proof is going to change anything.

Messianic message stirs debate

Scott, Aumsville, Oregon — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:32:06 GMT

The Old Testament, Hebrew writings penned by Hebrew leaders and prophets, is full of references to a suffering messiah. Check out Isaiah 53 for proof of this.

Messianic message stirs debate

Scott, Vista, CA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:33:14 GMT

Not sure what the outcome of the tablet will be, but the Old and New Testament are all part of the Bible for us Christians. Jesus was the fulfillment of Old Testament prophecy. This article makes it sound like there is a conflict between Biblical Christianity and the Old Testament, but there's not.

Messianic message stirs debate

Rick D — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:34:10 GMT

As a Christian this really presents no problems, conflicts or paradoxes with respect to my religion and my belief in the Lord and Jesus. If it is real or not it has no impact on my convictions.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ken corey Scranton PA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:34:52 GMT

This story should show Just how important the Jewish faith is to Christianity And How the 2 are 1 and that there was a clear and written proof of the coming of Jesus . It Should Be Clear to see a prophecy of the coming of Christ that the elders had figured out the meaning of scripture before it was furfilled Just a as little as 30 years before his comimg, Almost Like Now as we just start uncovering the true means of prophecy just shortly before it is furfilled.

Messianic message stirs debate

Hector NIeves — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:35:21 GMT

After so many century, still man will face the challenges; Go ahead proof is before ours eyes and only the blind can see.

Messianic message stirs debate

Dan Robillard, Bettystown, Ireland — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:35:46 GMT

This reeks of forgery. Isn't it just convient that this small scrap of stone would bear controversial text? Members of the Jewish faith are brothers of all Christians. We don't need "old" stones to shed new light. The truth is in us all.

Messianic message stirs debate

Scott Michaels — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:36:28 GMT

The world needs to get real. Even if this thing did predict a 3-day rising from the dead (which many religions were founded upon well before that time), it proves nothing. There exists no contemporaneous writing that documents any resurrection of Jesus. Even the gospels differ in their accounts. The stories that were written AFTER the supposed resurrection could easily have been written to conform to the predictive text (this happens throughout the new testament and the gospels (especially the ones chosen by the "the church" in Rome around 100 AD.

Messianic message stirs debate

GA, San Diego, CA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:36:53 GMT

I have a hard time believing that some scientist cannot prove/disprove the authenticity of this tablet, barely a couple of thousand years old, while others seemingly can prove that the earth and its inhabitants have existed and evolved for tens and hundreds of thousands of years.

Messianic message stirs debate

Angel Echevarria — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:37:56 GMT

Jesus died and lives again,we are seeing everything as the bible has said.the bible also states that the rocks will talk.Must we continue to doubt?I dont think so.

Messianic message stirs debate

Daniel, Tempe, AZ — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:38:32 GMT

This is just another piece of mythology which will be interpreted in many ways by religious people to fit their particular fantasies. The day they'll find a tablet from 2000 years ago predicting "the coming of Einstein," and his theory of relativity, I'll kneel down and convert.

Messianic message stirs debate

JoAnna, Seattle, WA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:38:44 GMT

well, the bible is pretty clear about Jesus being the Messiah. Even Jewish scholars have to agree that the compelling evidence is there and it says that the word of GOD will be the ultimate truth. I suppose only time will tell who is right. God says his word will stand forever. Too me, that is forever, no matter what those in the 21st century say. Time will tell.

Messianic message stirs debate

Larry Gasch — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:38:49 GMT

I doubt that this discovery will change anyone's mind. Those who accept a more literal interpretation of the Bible may see this as further confirmation. Those who believe the Bible is just so many myths and fantasies will see this as just another log on the funeral pyre of Christianity. As for me, I cast my vote with the latter.

Messianic message stirs debate

JC, Seattle WA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:39:09 GMT

Not a Christian here, nor looking to debunk Christianity. Believe what you will, however I think this stone will and should have little relevance in swaying anyone one way or the other. At best it proves nothing, at worst it's a forgery.

Messianic message stirs debate

dave king — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:40:03 GMT

wow,this is very interesting.i view my chirstan belief as the contiuation of judism

Messianic message stirs debate

cris vel — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:40:07 GMT

Just read carefuly Isaiah 53 and Psalm 22 and think for yourself. That is the picture of the Messiah and with just not much thinking you will see whos spoken picture that is. With so many others scripture, that isn't necessary to have anything else, yet it is good to see if those really look Biblical in all its entirety.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jim, Fort Worth, TX — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:40:21 GMT

Chalk up another Hit for the Book of Mormon - its Filled with this kind of stuff - and criticised roundly for it....Just another lucky guess.

Messianic message stirs debate

Steve Green — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:41:47 GMT

Jews, Christians, and Muslims worship the same God, in significantly different ways. Do we emphasize the similarities as "brothers" or the differences as competitors?

Messianic message stirs debate

Daniel Adams, Rockville, MD — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:42:10 GMT

I find it so interesting that people are surprised that there are Jewish roots to the Christian messiah, as if this were some new discovery! If the tablet is authentic, it only adds weight to the Christian doctrine that Jesus Christ fulfilled all the Jewish prophecies for a messiah. Jews thought the messiah would be a powerful political ruler, but the prophet Isaiah spoke of a suffering messiah hundreds of years before this tablet was written, one who would be "pierced for our transgressions" and "crushed for our iniquities" Isaiah 53:5

Messianic message stirs debate

Rabbi Bentzion Kravitz, Los Angeles, Caifornia — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:42:50 GMT

Even if there is a source for a resurrected Messiah in Judaism, the most important distinction between Judaism and Christianity is Judaism’s steadfast belief in the absolute unity of God that precludes the believe in the Trinity or the corporeal bodily incarnation of God. These doctrines are not found in Jewish scripture and were most probably introduced into Christianity as a result of Greek and Roman influence.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jordan, Seattle, WA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:42:59 GMT

The big question is: can it be dated? Anyone can write on a stone, but if the stone and the writing can be dated somehow to even 100 or 50 years before Christ, then you have something. But if 100 or 50 years after, then it means nothing.

Messianic message stirs debate

Charlie, Mobile, AL — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:43:51 GMT

Okay, so they found a rock that supposedly predates Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection, so it appears to predict what was to come. If it turns out to be authentic, my personal reaction would be "so what?" Jesus predicted his own death and resurrection himself, so why would the same thing written on a rock be anything special? The main thing people ought to care about, where Jesus is concerned, is that a totally harmless person was brutally murdered, and he shouldn't have been. It doesn't matter that he knew in advance that it would happen and that he purposely allowed himself to be killed. The real question is-- why did he do that, and what will be its ultimate result when he returns?

Messianic message stirs debate

Mary Randolph, Watertown, NY — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:45:35 GMT

"There are Jewish roots to almost everything in Christian experience."

No kidding! The same God inspired the Hebrew (Jewish) Scriptures, the Aramaic Scriptures, and the Christian Greek Scriptures. Jesus quoted extensively from "Jewish" Scripture and said at Matthew 5:17 that he came to the earth "not to destroy the Law (the Jewish Scriptures)" but rather "to fulfill." He then went on to impart the value and validity of the Hebrew scrolls that he had been studying all of his life. The apostle Paul (Jewish, BTW) also stated that "the Law (Hebrew Scripture) has become our (the Jews') tutor leading to Christ." Jesus himself was Jewish, the apostles were Jewish, and the first wave of Christians were Jewish. In fact, the faithful Jews of Christ's day were looking for a Messiah because the Hebrew Scriptures pointed the way to one arriving on the scene in their generation. They even thought John the Baptist might have been "the Christ" (Luke 3:15).

Jesus' Jewish contemporaries were, indeed, saying "'What is this man saying? I never heard anything like this! This is different,'" but for a completely different reason than this Shanks assumes. The audiences listening to Jesus were accustomed to having their rabbis "cite their sources," if you will, but Jesus spoke upon his own authority. For example, at Matthew 5:27, as part of his Sermon on the Mount, Jesus stated the following:
"You heard that it was said, 'You must not commit adultery' (Jewish authority). But I say to you that everyone that keeps on looking at a woman so as to have a passion for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart (his own authority)." So this view is not "out" because true Bible scholars already acknowledge the "Jewish roots to almost everything in Christian experience."

Many Hebrew texts prophesied about aspects of Jesus' birth, life, ministry, and resurrection, as well as his post-resurrection role in Heaven. This finding should not be surprising to anyone well versed enough in the Bible to know that there is much more to Jesus than "little stories."

Messianic message stirs debate

Lynn Kearney, Arlington, VA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:47:18 GMT

As a Roman Catholic, this (a prophecy about rising from the dead) makes perfect sense to me. We are rooted in Judaism.

Messianic message stirs debate

Tut Aint Cummin' — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:47:45 GMT

I have always maintained that God was created by man, but Religion say it's the other way around. Just look at the way all religions are structured - men are dominant in all of them.

Einstein said that "the word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish."

Why should people be so surprised that "Jesus" was not special? Religion is for people who cannot or would not accept reality.

Messianic message stirs debate

John V, Los Angeles, California — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:48:30 GMT

Faith in God himself what matters. The example of Jesus Christ as a son of God is a wonderful way to live your life. Artifacts are of little value to one's ultimate quality of life and progress toward being like our creator.

Messianic message stirs debate

Nelson Reimler, Midwest City, OK — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:49:09 GMT

God has a way to talk to the world to prepare them or warn them of things to come. Because people do not recognize a person of prophetic ability does not mean it is not so. I do not believe this debunks christian text, it reinforces it. If anything it should make us ponder what he is trying to tell us, he is God and he is in control and he will have things come to pass no matter how many people he has to use to get the message out. Above all, Jesus is the son of God and their is only one way to the Father, hear ye him, he points the way!

Messianic message stirs debate

Josiah — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:50:18 GMT

I don't see what's so shocking...

There are hundreds of messianic prophesies in the Old Testament that mirror Jesus' life, death, and resurrection.

Messianic message stirs debate

gary — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:50:37 GMT

This, along with other religious "discoveries" is a fake designed to wean people off of their religious convictions.

The Bilderbergers and the New World Order gang have been running this scam for decades now.

The purpose of weaning us from our religious convictions is to make us more reliant on existing, state-run references of "good" and "evil," and to remove many of the barriers we hold -- based on moral grounds -- that prevent us from participating fully in the material/self-aggrandizing environment that is necessary to fully institute a self-generated police state.

I know there's a lot here to get the mind around.

But we have to start somewhere.

Don't forget that the New World Order cultists in the Whitehouse right now founded their own "religion" on the Baconian assumption that Atlantis truly existed, that Atlantis is the United States, and that the current political and aristocratic elite in the US and worldwide are heirs to its "glory."

These people are absolute nutcases who want to destroy the current world and "return" to the old world, in which they believe they were "gods," and that their only purpose was to be worshipped by the rest of us, the "useless eaters" as the Bilderbergers describe us.

Messianic message stirs debate

ACLTony — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:51:12 GMT

The respect between Protestant Christianity and Judaism is actually closer and far greater than the media ever acknowledges as we worship the one true and same God. Most of us will continue to refer to the KJ Bible and the Torah for factual, historical accuracy as well as for the detailed references in Daniel's and John's prophetic words regarding the end times, not the news media or hollywood (more accurately "hollywierd's) versions and twisted interpretations.

Messianic message stirs debate

rad Manly — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:52:18 GMT

it turn out to be just one more interesting twist in the saga of scriptural scholarship

Messianic message stirs debate

Ed Oyler, Oxnard, Ca. — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:52:28 GMT

Jesus was a jew who rose from the dead in three days. What more can I say.

Messianic message stirs debate

Dan Roberts, Encinitas — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:54:28 GMT

very good article. I am in the middle of a great book on doing similar research into the validity of the "new" findings presented fron old discovered texts. It's really fascinating how these folks can date these just by writing styles or knowing what was happening in history at the time to validate. The book is by a former editor from the Chicago Tribune and is called "The case for the real Jesus". Whether you are religious or not; it backgrounds the methodology of verifiaction.

Messianic message stirs debate

Thomas Gordon — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:54:36 GMT

Look, it doesn't even appear to be properly translated, it's hard to date a stone,or even the markings in a stone, to say it's 1st century BC? Where does that come from?

Doesn't seem to specific does it? Also Jesus was not the only one to "die and be raised in 3 days", nor the only man/god of that time period to be crucified. If you look back, the Man/God death and resurrection story was going strong through the mediteratian are around 1-3bc. They were also all born on the shortest day of the year and resurrected at or near the spring equinox.

I consider myself a Christian, but I'm not going to grab onto something like this as fact, that is nothing to prove it's legitimacy. Shoot, I could dig out a stone from the area and claim that this is where Jesus fed the 5,000! From this rock!

Point is, this is even less substantial than the tomb of Jesus, which is questionable at best.

The point it guys.. lets stop this historical search for proof. To find proof would deny the power of faith. Faith is what drives out believes, if you could prove it, it wouldn'tbe faith.. so no, this is a waste of time.

Messianic message stirs debate

Fred Dallas — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:54:37 GMT

Hopefully religious people will realize that the text in the bible is just as dubious as that found today.

Messianic message stirs debate

Steve Lippert Cincinnati, OH — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:54:51 GMT

I don't understand what the big deal is. Current Old Testament prophets foretold the coming of a messiah and of suffering and dying and a third day resurrection. Assuming this is the real deal, it would only seem to confirm what previous texts already foretold.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jim swelgin, Fallbrook, CA. — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:54:58 GMT

I see no inconsistency in the facts as laid out in this text. Political problems may persist amongst those " learned" folks, but Christians do believe in the Bible, both Old and New Testament. If "Man" has erred in interpretation in the Middle Ages, so be it. Let's not get hung up on technicalities

Messianic message stirs debate

Joseph Kelly, Sterling, VA — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:55:40 GMT

The proof is in the pudding.... But I have little doubt it will affect the Jewish religion in any way. They've denied His truth for over 2000 years. It would take a miracle to change that.

Messianic message stirs debate

Patrick Hansen, La Crosse, Wi — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:56:07 GMT

The Catholic faith has always taught that the Jews were holders of the Old Testament faith. This Old Testament faith forshadowed the new, which would be the Catholic faith. Whether this tablet is authentic or not does not matter in the spiritual sense since the Jews have already rejected their savior. In the physical sense, Christ used the Jews own prophecies to show that his birth, death and resurection were what the prphets were in fact talking about. This tablet (if authenticated) would be another proof that they have missed on identifying their messiah.

Messianic message stirs debate

Brian Maughan, Twin Falls, ID — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:56:57 GMT

This is no shock that Jewish scripture describes a Christian belief. This makes perfect sense and only confirms Christianity. Christ was Jewish and so was everyone else that wrote in the New Testament and even much of the Old Testament. This is no shock.

Messianic message stirs debate

Gene Lockwood ,New York ,NY — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:58:11 GMT

This is cool.
Gabriel you may find is one of the Lords of the seven rays. Wisdom and Vision.
I beleive you can speak to Elizabeth Clare Prophet
for more on Gabriel.

Messianic message stirs debate

Elaine Parny — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 23:59:07 GMT

Should the tablet be proven authentic, I believe, from what little was referenced in your article, that the tablet would reinforce the already acknowledged intricate connection between Judaism and Christianity. Once, again, science supporting the faith and belief system of fundamental Christianity.

Messianic message stirs debate

Kirk Larsen — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:01:06 GMT

' Finally, what impact would a pre-Christian reference to suffering, death and resurrection have on Christian scholarship?'

The OT already has several prophetic statements about the coming suffering messiah. Psalms 22 and Isaiah 53 are just a couple. Jesus himself said that the prophetic scriptures stated that he would suffer and die. The jews just didn't see the gap between him coming as a lamb and then later as a lion. This stone doesn't change anything but just further confirms the realiablity and validity of the scriptures we already have.

Messianic message stirs debate

stephen ballard, plano, tx — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:02:27 GMT

This concept of a 3 day resurrection does have a scriptural precedent in the Old Testament. It was part of the rain fertility cult of that time and was associated with the mourning for the dead Lord [Adonai], followed later by rejoicing for the risen Lord [Adonikam] who was also Baal Hadad or Hadad Rimmon, and possibly also Adoni Yah, who replaced Baal as the god of storms in the religion of the southern Yahwists.

Hos 6:1 Come, and let us return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up. After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight. Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth.

Jas 5:7 Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the husbandman waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receive the early and latter rain. Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh.

Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth [ land ] mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Zec 12:11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadad Rimmon in the valley of Megiddon. And the land shall mourn, every family [tribe] apart.............All the families [tribes] that remain, every family [tribe] apart, and their wives apart.

Messianic message stirs debate

Sharon, Monrovia, California — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:04:48 GMT

The doctrines and additional scriptures of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (nicknamed "Mormons") have always taught that Christ and all the rest of us have existed since long before our mortal birth, and that Christ was the Jehovah of the Old Testament. We also assert that "many plain and precious things" such as these have been deleted or changed in the Bible, originally during a great apostasy that occurred during the first two centuries A.D. (Today, of course, you can go to any bookstore and find over 50 different versions of the Bible, some of which have done the same thing).

Whether or not this tablet is authentic, we can answer all the Christian/Judism questions raised in this article because we are Christ's Restored Church, founded and continuing on the basis of direct revelation from God the Father and His Son, Jesus Christ. We exist to prepare the world for Christ's second coming. Let our members and missionaries talk with you.

Messianic message stirs debate

Donald D Jones — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:05:25 GMT

The Jesus story is rife with references to Old Testament prophecy; Jeremiah and Micah...Luke and Matthew wrote from a perspective that Jesus was fulfilling prophecy by constructing a story based on Old Testament (Jewish) prophecy. This discovery would certainly support this scholarship, if proven credible, otherwise, it doesn't really matter since there is excellent scholarship already supporting this notion. This stuff is wonderful headline grabbers, but does little to making the Kingdom of God (peace and love) real for today.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jereolee W. Hickey, Walla Walla, WA. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:06:35 GMT

No matter what ideas the "experts" scatter back and forth,unless the new finds parralel the teaching of the bible, I will put them in a frame, hang them on my wall as interesting artifacts. Then delete all the comments.

Messianic message stirs debate

Brian, Cleveland Ohio — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:06:43 GMT

It only reveals motifs in the Jewish tradition, which were later intentionally spliced in to the story of Jesus to bolster the notion that he was the messiah. Another example: the similarity of the Passover story and Herod's effort to kill Jesus (Matthew 2:16)

Messianic message stirs debate

Mike, Cleveland, Ohio — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:09:27 GMT

Well...to me this is a confirmation of the accounts of the bible. There was always a close tie between pre-Christian Judaism and early Christianity. As a Christian, I've learned that the origins of Christianity are from Judaism. From Abraham, through Moses to the Last Supper (celebrating the feast of Passover) it is tied together. In fact when Moses received the ten commandments he was also told to keep the passover tradition. The two are and were unseperable until Christ.

It is great to see a historical tablet that supports the tie between the two. In Christian history we've been taught that there was expectations of a messia and there were many pretenders. The profits fortold of a messia so seeing it in "writing" is uplifting.

Messianic message stirs debate

Brad, Spokane, Wash — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:09:51 GMT

The writers of the bible likely already knew about this block or atleast its prophecy when they wrote the scripture, so is it really much of a shock that they would write it to fit the prediction perfectly?

Messianic message stirs debate

Dean Berry, Wells, Nevada — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:12:18 GMT

This examplifies how ignorant even Christian Americans are about the Messiah, Jesus Christ. This article talks about a link between Judaism and Christianity. Duh. Jesus Christ fulfilled over 300 messianic prophecies, meaning prophecies from the Old Testament. Our LORD surely knows how to throw 'em a curve, doesn't He? Just when the jews take over the bulk of America's media and use it to bury the fact that Jesus is the Messiah, Jehovah comes through with yet another revelation. Hallelujah!

Messianic message stirs debate

jdtseattlewa — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:12:46 GMT

Oh great, here comes the freight train of "I-told-you-so's" And even if it turns out to be a forgery, they will still be baying like hounds for the next three decades.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jim, Mansfield, Oh — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:14:43 GMT

The Jews of the First Century wanted a temporal deliverer but got Jesus who told them his Kingdom was not of this world. The tablet could be a prophecy of Jesus but like Nostradamos' writings it is vague and subject to various interpretations. Genuine or not, will probably not be determined until the Second Coming.

Messianic message stirs debate

Emily Dale, Franklin, North Carolina — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:14:49 GMT

It is much too early to make any judgments about this tablet. Anything is merely speculation at this point in time, even though there will be both Christian and Jewish persons who will read their own interpretation into the tablet.

Messianic message stirs debate

Melanie, Ann Arbor — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:15:15 GMT

Please... The Old Testament Prophets, and occasional Psalm, and even some of the books that the Jewish tradition call the Torah "give utterance" to the Messiah who is to come. What does it portend for ole' Christian... what has always been known: - That He is King of Kings and Lord of Lords, His Name is Wonderful, Counselor, Rose of Sharon, The Bright and Morning Star, Prince of Peace, Emmanuel, Jesus...

So to answer your question: The Good News continues to be Good News, however it is Ultra-Good News and mayhap be a bombshell to those who have walked the path of disbelief.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ron Allton — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:16:25 GMT

In taking the phrase "In three days, you shall live" as a reference to the Christian’s Jesus before the full context of Gab’s writing (who, what, where, when, why etc.) is known would be very unwise it would seem. It would not be unheard of for a Christian to jump to this conclusion however. Well meaning Christians have been doing this sort of thing since Philip interpreted the Hebrew scriptures to the Ethiopian eunuch, and the other Apostles -including Paul- wrote their stories of Jesus.
The Tablet and ink writings are interesting finds, if we could just ‘fill in the blanks’ and know the real context of Gab’s writing.
Ron Allton, Palm Bay, FL

Messianic message stirs debate

Richard Pursell, Poncha Springs, CO — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:16:43 GMT

It should be no surprise that the Tanakh (Old Testament) would speak of a suffering Messiah, for Jesus himself made reference to it.
"Then charged he his disciples that they should tell no man that he was Jesus the Messiah. From that time forth began Jesus to show unto his disciples (from the Old Testament?), how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day. Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee" (Matthew 16:20).
After his resurrection, it is recorded:
"Then opened he their (the eleven disciples’) understanding, that they might understand the (Old Testament) scriptures, and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Messiah to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day" (Luke 24:46).

While Jesus does not give the exact references, one may suspect the following to have been among them: Daniel 9:26, Isaiah 53, Psalm 22, and Psalm 69, Jonah 1:17. Readers will notice a number of exact fulfillments in these passages. As for the Jonah reference, Dr. E.W. Bullinger says in his "Figures of Speech used in the Bible," p. 845, “The expression 'three days and three nights' is an idiom which covers any part of three days and three nights.” He cites 1Samuel 30: 11, 12, and 13 as proof as well as Esther 4:16, both of which use the former expression and then explain it to be “the third day.” The “third day,” may be reckoned from Jesus’ death Friday the 14th Abib to Sunday the first day of the week, exactly as the Pascal lamb was to be slain on the 14th of the first Jewish month (Exodus 12:6) and the “firstfruits” of the harvest offered on the following “morrow after the Sabbath” (Leviticus 23:10), in other words Sunday.

Whether the stone in question proves to be real or fake does not alter the testimony of these passages to which it is likely Jesus himself referred.

Messianic message stirs debate

Chris Hi, Calif. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:17:57 GMT

Boy! That's some ink! Too bad that today we have no durable inks that write on stone and can weather so well as to leave any message at all. Or maybe we do. Either way it would sure be nice if everyone didn't get their panties in a bunch over this stuff while having a little faith in science. There's some stuff that works! CH

Messianic message stirs debate

Timothy Ricketts — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:18:01 GMT

No surprise here, even if the stone may not be authentic. We American Christians have forgotten that Jesus was/is the Jewish Messiah promised by the God of Israel in the Hebrew Scriptures. That Jesus is also the universal Lord, Savior, and Head of a mostly Gentile church is a testament to God's limitless grace, offered to all the world as promised by the Hebrew prophets. We Gentiles should be thankful that God has grafted us into the story of salvation as well (Romans 11:17).

Messianic message stirs debate

Clarence Williams, Washington — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:18:04 GMT

Mr. Alan Boyle, as long as everyone understands, that what? already written down, cannot be change God, will send, Jesus Christ, to the earth again to purge this place even if no one believe's one more word of scripture!

Messianic message stirs debate

Gerald Watt, Bowling Green, KY — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:18:28 GMT

Skepticism of all discoveries is common. Evidence is the attribute that dissolves fact from fiction. But from where does the evidence come? Will the evidence be manufactured? Or, will it be scholarly reviews and compared to other writing of the same period. If the writings prove to be true, then a "bombshell" will no doubt be exploded. Will Judah accept a messia did come? Will Christians relish the authority of that which is called the New Testament?
I think neither. The Jews of today cannot prove their Jewish lineage because of the destruction of the geneologies. And the Christians are so inept in reading and following the manuscripts already at hand division among the follows of Christ create more atheist or agnoist believers than Christian. So in the end it really will make no difference, because people will only believe that which they have been taught and are hardpressed to believe or follow any doctrine that does not agree with their particular philosphy. And, their philosphy so often is founded upon what they think the evidence may be rather than what it is!

Messianic message stirs debate

John Horst, San Diego — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:18:50 GMT

This discovery will strengthen C.S. Lewis' observation about Jesus... the "good moral teacher" just isn't an honest option. With what we already know from the Dead Sea Scrolls (DSS), this discovery and the claims Jesus made for himself in the Gospels, he can only be one of two things: either he is the hoped for Jewish messiah (albeit not coming quite as Judaism expected) or he was a raving lunatic. If he really did die and rise again on the third day, a testimony generations of martyrs have died for, then his claims have to be taken seriously.

Messianic message stirs debate

jdtseattlewa — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:20:27 GMT

PRAY TELL, why is this in Cosmic Log in the first place? I thought this was supposed to be a forum for rational discussion and scientific discovery. When did it become a sly platform for drowning out it's own subject matter with unfalsifiable balderedash? If this is where your journalisim is heading, it's high time you handed this column over to someone who is still interested in the subjects that you tell the rest of us that you are.

Messianic message stirs debate

David — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:20:28 GMT

I fail to see why this is a surprise. The earliest known copies of the book of Isaiah, which contain scriptural references to a suffering, resurrected messiah, date back 500 years prior to the birth of Jesus, hence they are considered prophetic in nature. The idea of Jesus death and resurrection on the third day, the nature of his death, and the age of grace are all fortold years before they occurred.

Messianic message stirs debate

shirley joe, reading pa — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:21:44 GMT

do christians really not know that Jesus is a Jew who came to save his own? the entire bible is a Jewish book written by Jewish men.gentiles who have believed in Jesuhua or Jesus are grafted into the faith, everyone needs to go back to the roots.he is not methodist ,catholic, ucc or any other denomination. let the truth be told.

Messianic message stirs debate

Paul, Tucson, AZ — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:22:07 GMT

During the time of Jesus, the Jews were not looking for a suffering Messiah, they were looking for a Messiah that would free them from Roman oppression. However, a suffering Messiah is clearly depicted in vivd detail in the old testament in Isaiah 53.

Messianic message stirs debate

Todd, Midway Utah — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:22:31 GMT

Mormon (The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) theology teaches that Adam and Eve were taught the doctrine of a messiah. This teaching periodically was lost (in part or full) from human conscienceless as human philosophies gained acceptance over communications from God and prophetic teaching. The Old Testament records the teachings of multiple prophets who, directed by revelation, taught and re-taught the central doctrine of a messiah. At the time of Jesus Christ, the understanding of the roll of a messiah was generally misunderstood and the messiah was not recognized by the Jewish populace or humanity in general.

Therefore, as a Mormon, this discovery is welcome but not surprising. I hope those involved are honest and that the stone, if found authentic, becomes a valued part of the shared discussion between people of all faiths. It is my belief that historic artifacts are of value when they lead to communication between individuals and God to find truth.

Messianic message stirs debate

Rev. James L. Breed, Ph.D. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:23:04 GMT

Unprovinenced artifacts such as this are notoriously difficult to authenticate. The scholars virtually always "go to war" with each other about their authenticity, often dividing against each other along ideological lines as well as on scholarly opinion. However, if a "paper trail" of some sort can show where this artifact came from, there may be hope for its authentication. No, I don't think it will change Jewish-Christian relationships - but it will, I think, more firmly establish Jesus within the 1st-century Jewish messianic/apocalyptic culture.

Messianic message stirs debate

Matt, Spokane, WA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:25:09 GMT

While in College, I spent some time drawing parallels to what Jesus said to what he might have read from various Greek philosophers and/or even mythological figures. While my research was fleeting at best, I began to formulate an opinion that Jesus was interpreting and embellishing ideas that were hardly original. I think as time passes, we will see revelations which will further show that Jesus was in fact a scholar of great merit, well-read and was enlightened -- indeed, a man ahead of his time. What I'm saying is not to suggest Jesus isn't God, it helps me for one put Him into a more realistic perspective. Be born, learn the works of man (to date), and profess the best of it.

Messianic message stirs debate

Kyle, MD — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:25:09 GMT

How is this in any way surprising? The Gospels tell of Jesus mentioning Scripture referring to the Temple being rebuilt in three days, by which the Apostles later realized he was referring to himself. I thought it was already widely accepted that Christian beliefs about Jesus fit into Jewish messianic beliefs, scriptures and prophesies.

That second to last paragraph really says it all: Christians will see this as further evidence that Jesus was the fulfillment of Jewish scripture and atheists and skeptics will view it as all of of the same mythology. This changes nothing about the debate over Jesus, Judaism and religion at large.

Messianic message stirs debate

anonymous — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:26:30 GMT

The Old Testament is full of references to the future King who will suffer, die, and rise again. Someone who knew the Old Testament well simply wrote it on a slab before Jesus was born. I do not understand the controversy. This simply confirms what Christians affirm, that both the Old and New Testament point to Christ.

Messianic message stirs debate

Tim M., New York, NY — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:28:58 GMT

It's all about myths that weave the culture. Nothing more. But the most fascinating thing about it is what it reveals about ancient human culture, and what it becomes will say much about contemporary human culture.

Messianic message stirs debate

jon skinner, new orleans, la — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:30:05 GMT

Very interesting stuff... if what you write is true. I look forward to seeing how this plays out- I just wish the research could be presented unbiased and allow readers to interpret how they wish.

Messianic message stirs debate

(Keith Hass, Seattle, Wash.) — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:31:48 GMT

It is an exciting find. i would hope it is not a "cry Wolf" incident again. I am not religious, but it may help a lot of peple to know that there are facts related to their faith from pieces in the past. Now if we could just get inside the Holy of Holies in Ethiopia! I am so very curious.

Messianic message stirs debate

Rick Creech, Tallahasse, Florida — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:32:01 GMT

Strange that people want to spend so much time in the study of other writings. The Bible is the Word of God. The Bible is the writings that God Himself has given and presevred for the human race.

Messianic message stirs debate

frankhorton arkansas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:32:18 GMT

are you certain this message pre dates christ? could this message of gabriel actually be a post message written after christ? could this be a false message written by some one seeking money? what proof is there that this message dates from two or three thousand years ago? this all seems very odd.

Messianic message stirs debate

David Yandow, Marietta, GA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:32:40 GMT

Just another of the many pieces of evidence that vindicates the Mormon prophet Joseph Smith. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is exactly what it says it is. http://www.mormon.org

Messianic message stirs debate

norman, LA, Ca. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:33:02 GMT

Jesus is the jewish messiah. The jews missed it. But Jesus is coming back to set up his earthly kingdom. read the new testament, Jesus is the fullfillment of the law. they thought the law was external but it was not. thats what the sermon on the mount is all about. Read Isaiah 61:1-2 but onlythe first line of verse 2. this was fullfilled in luke 4:17-21. when he returns, that is Jesus, it will be to pour out Gods wrath on this sinfull world. thats why we must repent and give our lives to Christ. to much to say. Jesus needs to open your spiritual eyes so as to understand.

Messianic message stirs debate

K. Cameron, Kona, HI — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:33:54 GMT

Religions are an extension of mythology. Mythology was man's attempt at confronting uncertainty and the unknown.
Religious lore should therefore be considered in the light of historical archealogical discoveries--------not 'magical' inferences.

Messianic message stirs debate

Read the Bible — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:34:06 GMT

Why all the commotion? The Old Testament mentions a suffering Messiah who will die (Isaiah 53). The experience of Jonah foretells the Messiah being dead for 3 days (Jonah 1:17;2:10). Do these "scholars" never read the Bible?

Messianic message stirs debate

cyndy mcadaragh Herford AZ — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:34:14 GMT

This message of Christ is predicted all throughout the whole Bible. Any true Christian studies both the Old and the New testament of the Bible. Jesus was born in Bethehem and is a descendant of the line of David who is Jewish. This is all in the Bible which is the true History of Christ- God -Father Son and Holy Spirit.

Messianic message stirs debate

Cheryl Adkins, Clendenin, WV — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:35:02 GMT

Even if the stone is real, then certainly Jesus and his followers knew about the prediction. So in order to give more credence to Jesus' message they would say and do what prophecy required to make him the messiah.

Messianic message stirs debate

J. Levinson, Pasco, Washington — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:35:09 GMT

I come from the Messianic Jew side of the equation, and do believe Yeshua (Jesus) to be the promised Messiah. This is most interesting, but any believer in the Messiah, any Christian, would be the first to tell you that our vision and faith is not on things of this earth, and no matter what this turns out to be, it's merely a curiosity. The real treasure is in heaven, awaiting the day of His return!

Messianic message stirs debate

brad wallin — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:36:14 GMT

i think those who believe in jesus will be raised from the dead spiritually to be as like he is this is the third day because gods time is one day is like a thousand years i see and feel birth pains i hope all will prepare the way for our lord jesus the son of man will come in a moment you think not like the flood be ready and beleive on jesus your lord you scholars who debate till the coming of jesus if scripture be true repent and be baptised for the time is fullfilled and the kingdom of god is come if you believe god the kingdom is in your heart and mind seeing and believing so to speak god does the rest

Messianic message stirs debate

Tim Rommes, Washington, UT — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:39:23 GMT

On it's own it doesn't look like anything more than religous ramblings. Too many holes to even make sense. Even with more complete text it would be hard to push this past Jim Jones/David Koresh kind of nonsense. Assuming it is genuine and correctly dated it's from a time when Jews were desperate for the Messiah, and desperately looking for the Messiah. How many stories have been lost to antiquity that were based only on the hope that a savior would soon come? Stories based on hope are neither history nor prophecy, just comforting during that time of trouble. Unless some other documentation comes to light to fill in the gaps and possibly add to the length I don't see where there's even anything to pursue. Hopefully there will be someone who pursues it anyway, just to be sure nothing is overlooked. Even if the length and bredth are filled out, the most I can see from this framework is that there were splinter factions in Judaism. Hardly news. Now if it's filled with other prophetic sayings, some unique, specific and fulfilled, well ...

Messianic message stirs debate

Grey, reno, nv. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:39:39 GMT

Those that want to believe will believe and doubters will doubt. If you can't go on faith you can't go at all. No proof is necessary and no proof is sufficient. Only you can decide for you,,,

Messianic message stirs debate

William E. Sanchez — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:41:25 GMT

I feel it is best not to 'superimpose' one religion over another. Let us respect Judaism as well as Christianity for what each profess apart from each other. Jesus act of 'redemption,' His passion, death and resurrection is not dependent upon any previous profecy, viable or contrived. The 'Gabriel stone' is an object for archeologists and historians to study and analyze, but for those on a journey of Faith, the stone is immatieral.

Messianic message stirs debate

kenneth gifford 301s.signal butte rd #127 apache junction, az. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:42:02 GMT

this early release of the find before it's had time to be thoughly studied may result in in a zealous pre interpetation. perhaps we should be attentive to those who have had time studying the artifact.

Messianic message stirs debate

Stephen Bennett, Encinitas, CA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:43:49 GMT

While the resurrection was a surprise, the notably pre-Christian Hebrew Scriptures are not without descriptions of a Jewish Messiah (1) who gives his life for the "healing" of the nation--Isaiah 53, (2) arrives in the early 1st century--Daniel 9, etc. So to wonder "Where the hell did this come from, baby?" seems a little extreme.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jonathan P. USA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:43:52 GMT

Hardcore Cristians will say its planted by Satan, but a thinking person will understand that its just another Messiah fable, like the fable of Jesus Christ. Why do some stories get written off as mythology, like Zeus for example, and the story of Christ taken so seriously? Why were the gospels written decades after Christ was supposedly on earth? Why werent they written by people who actually witnessed the events? Sadly, most simply accept the religion of there parents and continue following what they are taught at there local church, without ever really researching what they are being taught. Mostly, out of fear of displeasing their parents, and living under the fear of being tortured for all eternity in a burning hell fire, by a God of love. Religion was invented by men to control other men.

Messianic message stirs debate

Tom Munchbach Sr. Lansing, Michigan — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:45:00 GMT

How pitiful Humanity,We concern ourselves with a piece of stone when we ought to be concerned with the "ROCK" JESUS WAS RAISED FROM THE DEAD!! JESUS WAS A JEW!! And yes the Jews had foreknowledge of that ROCK! That's what their writings ALL made reference to. The ROCK of YOUR SALVATION. They still have a veil over their eyes Nationally, and can not see the Messiah, JESUS, "because God hath blinded their eyes" until you, the Gentiles are saved to the last one that is willing. But He is coming again, and has warned:"Be ye also ready for in such an hour as ye think not, the SON of MAN cometh." "...the Powers of Heaven shall be shaken..." "...there shall be weeping and wailing, and nashing of teeth..." "God shall gather together His elect from the four winds..." You really believe that the earth is 30,000,000 years old?? Surprise!! JESUS WILL SIT ON THE THRONE IN JERUSALEM AS KING...for the next thousand years..."Every knee shall bow, and every tongue confess to the Glory of God, that Jesus Christ is LORD." You know HIM?? HE's your CREATOR, and HE made all this vast Universe. Why can't we simply believe that?? Hear that still small voice? That's the Lord trying to get your attention. "Hear and your soul shall live."

Messianic message stirs debate

weston m erasito, clifton nj — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:46:30 GMT

Yahweh is showing further proof that noone else except Jesus is the Messiah who shaded his blood of everyone on the cross. Who else died and resurrected in three days? God does not want any execuses to say I did not know Jesus is or was the Messiah. it is true He is coming again as the completion to all the prophecies which have been fulfilled and yet to be fulfilled.

Messianic message stirs debate

Isaac, Temecula, California — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:47:20 GMT

Strange lack of information shared here. Christian/Jewish scholars already know that the scriptures and Talmud hinted at both a conquering and a suffering Messiah- some scribes suggested before Christ that the Messiah would come twice, just based on the prophesies- once to suffer, and again to conquer evil. Some suggested that there might even be two messiahs. The idea of a ressurection can also be inferred from the Jewish scripture prophesies, and a third-day ressurection would be assumed for various reasons based on the scriptures. There doesn't seem to be anything on the tablet that wasn't already gleaned from the Old Testament prophesies by someone. If anything this shows that the devout Jews were practically over-analyzing messianic scripture passages, because of the prophesy in Daniel that placed the Messiah's coming around the time of Christ. You'd expect to find lots of Messiah-heavy religous writings around then.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ref. Fr. Remus Bleahu, Youngstown, Ohio — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:47:28 GMT

I have studied Orthodox christian Theology for 9 years and now I am on PHD program for Old Testament.
I was thought by my professors that the Jewish people will turn to the Christian faith by their own rabbis being convinced that the true Mesiah already came.
The old Testment prophesized the life of Jesus from A to Z. The Code of the Bible (Torah) and the new evidences of the existance of Jesus and the future proofs are leading towards the predictions of the Orthodox Christian theology. This tablet is just another proof of that.

Messianic message stirs debate

Todd from Atlanta, Ga. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:47:42 GMT

This is a poorly written article. There are so many incomplete thought, questions raised and left unanswered and even some bad editing: here is one example (Some of most exacting judges of antiquities have been taking a close look at the artifact - and the advance indications are that the tablet has been passing the tests so far.) I imagine it should read, some of the most...
It seems to be an attempt to muddy the water, same old stuff.

Messianic message stirs debate

Vivien Hight — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:48:41 GMT

Anyone who is serious about Bible study will not only become quickly aware of the Jewish roots of our faith, they will welcome the connection. I am deeply indebted to the Hebrew peoples for the Saviour that was given to me (albeit through their rejection of the very Messiah that was proclaimed to them throughout their own writings and prophecies). All my love to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob; I look forward to meeting them.

The ironic thing is, in today's age, so many archaeological discoveries are pointing to the truth that "precept upon precept" Christians have known throughout history. New discoveries in DNA science, astronomical studies etc make all of the claims of Christ specifically, and the Bible in totality, more and more verifiable. I don't have to argue the veracity of Scripture so often anymore; I simply wait for science to verify what is already there.

Now the most important point needs to be made: since Scripture is apprx. 70% prophecy, then we are in fact awaiting the imminent return of Jesus which will be preceded by the disappearance of millions of people, myself joyfully included. How will science and the mass media explain that one away? How will the media explain Israel away when she indeed becomes the center of world history?

Stay tuned...

Messianic message stirs debate

Yese Otero, Los Angeles, CA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:48:42 GMT

I hope for a world that finally accepts that the Messiah came once and is coming back soon. Little by little that would prove to be an universal truth and not just by faith but soon with science based back up.

Messianic message stirs debate

Virginia, Church Point, LA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:48:54 GMT

This is very interesting, but the media seems to think that somehow the tablet and writing may have a negative effect on Christianity and Judaism. I do not see how this could legitimately happen.

Messianic message stirs debate

Richard Nielsen, Seattle WA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:49:23 GMT

The "three days dead and rise again" story is hardly unique to the Christian tradition - it is a archetypal story found often in BC history. Read John Spong's latest book and work through some Joseph Campbell comparitive mythology. Christianity is one of many traditions that uses the metaphor of resurrection three days after death.
RAN

Messianic message stirs debate

Arctodus — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:50:33 GMT

This is much ado about little. The "revelation concerns known things and adds little to knowledge of the times or the event. In other words, so what?

Messianic message stirs debate

Bob Miller — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:50:59 GMT

The pagan followers of Mithra believed in a virgin birth, attended by 3 magi, his later death and resurrection. They practiced communion with bread and wine, and baptism. They also celebrated his birth on Dec 25th. Sound familiar? All of this PRE-Christian. The church didn't even confirm the divinity of Christ until 325 AD. Religion is a STORY organized by a class of individuals who don't want to do real work. Unfortunately the facts of history is not enough to unseat our need for this Santa Claus.

Messianic message stirs debate

Bryant Lister, Gresham, OR — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:51:35 GMT

The age of a fairy tale is no testament to it's validity as anything but a fairy tale. Will people look back 2000 years from now and wonder about Harry Potter, the way they wonder about the Jesus character now? Seriously, debating these stories as if they are history is childish.

Messianic message stirs debate

Remus Bleahu, Youngstown, OH — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:52:37 GMT

This is just another piece in the puzzle of the Jewish people getting to convert to Christianity.
This will be done by their rabbis sooner or later. The truth cannot be hiden forever.

Messianic message stirs debate

Steve, Chicago, IL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:54:15 GMT

"A story that quoted one professor as saying some Christians would "find it shocking" that Jewish scriptures prefigured Christian theology." Shows how uninformed some professors are.

The Old Testament has numerous references to a Messiah that were and are fulfilled by Jesus Christ. These Jewish passages are embraced by Christians as evidence that Jesus is the Christ, the Messiah for Jews and Gentiles. Read Isaiah 53. It is but one example of this

Messianic message stirs debate

Peter Christy, Lees Summit, Missouri — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:55:22 GMT

Well, reading the translated text, you really do have to "shift mental gears" to make much sense of it. A lot of the original Hebrew characters are missing or illegible so even the literal translation suffers, to say nothing of a "polished" English translation.

This is definitly a task for the experts in deciphering antiquities - the same people who labored so long on the Dead Sea Scrolls.

One thought from the story, above, does have me mystified - namely that a professor was quoted as saying some Christians would "find it shocking" that Jewish scriptures prefigured Christian theology.

As a Christian I've always been taught, and personally observed, that many passages in what we call "The Old Testament" foretell the coming of a Messiah who would be a sacrifice for our sins, and would be raised from the dead, three days later.

So, even if this latest find does prove out, it would just be one more reference to what most Christians accept as a fact anyway.

Messianic message stirs debate

Terry — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:55:36 GMT

Not shocking at all. The Jewish scriptures are the foundation of Christianity.

Messianic message stirs debate

MARTHA MILLER — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:57:38 GMT

APPARENTLY AT OUR MOST TIME OF DOUBT AND DESPAIR (OIL AND FOOD PRICES UP)UNEMPLOYMENT,DISAPPOINTMENT IN OUR POLITICAL FIGURES,IMMIGRATION ISSUES,IRAQ,IRAN,AFGHANISTAN SO ON,JESUS TAKES PITY ON US AND GIVES US SOMETHING TO REMEMBER THAT HE IS ALWAYS THERE. ANALYTICAL COMPREHENSION OF THE TABLET WILL SOLVE NOTHING IT IS THE FAITH IN THE RESURRECTION THAT HAS ANY IMPACT ON CHRISTIANITY AND JEWISH BELIEFS.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jeff Fazio, Richmond, Virginia — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:58:14 GMT

Theologically speaking further revelation brought forth by such artifacts as this tablet will do little to prove or disprove any of the later books, like the Textus Receptus or Septuagint. Scientist or archaeologist could point their fingers to any one find and claim proof of GOD and still there will be skeptics. True, unadulterated Christianity holds to a foundational truth that the current bible is the inerrant WORD of GOD to which nothing shall be added nor has anything been taken away, nor lost to time.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ed C. Boston, MA. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:59:39 GMT

Are there elements of a Messiah who is going to shed blood and pay for sins in the Jewish writings? Of course there are. A famous prediction comes from Isaiah 53, written some 7 or 8 centuries before Christ. Here is how the coming of the Messiah was foretold:

"But he was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon him, and by his wounds we are healed."

"Yet it was the LORD's will to crush him and cause him to suffer,and though the LORD makes his life a guilt offering, he will see his offspring and prolong his days, and the will of the LORD will prosper in his hand. "

Messianic message stirs debate

chris, strongsville, ohio — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:02:39 GMT

I don't understand why everybidy needs scientific proof in understanding religion. Religion is supposed to be faith-based. It should not be based on evidence. Obviously the believers such as myself see this as a foreshadowing of the death of Jesus Christ and the skeptics will always have a bone to pick with that. I thought that this was a very interesting article but i thought should have gone into a little more detail about the apocalyptic events that it contained in it.

Messianic message stirs debate

William Spanaway, WA. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:05:10 GMT

Let's wait for more scientific examination as to dating. Let other forensic scientists/scholars check it out before we get too excited.

Messianic message stirs debate

Pat Luquis, St. Cloud, FL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:05:25 GMT

What better revelation, in these times of progressive religious polarization by virtue of militant Islamists, to coalesce Christian and Jewish interests? The line in the desert sands has been clearly drawn by the extremists; Gabriel's vision will serve to unite Christian and Jew in defense of modernity.

Messianic message stirs debate

Astonished at the "new journalism" — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:05:48 GMT

Good filler. Very good use of what used to be called "Column inches". Best of luck to you. Bless your heart. Are you just on vacation???

Messianic message stirs debate

Burr Deming, St. Louis, MO — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:07:09 GMT

Our site takes the position that the most important part of Holy Scripture is the inspiration behind the words. Jesus spoke repeatedly and harshly against the literalists of that day. His popularity among the people was one reason for the conspiracy to crucify him.

My bet is that any revelation of an existing scripture reinforcing that inspiration will strengthen genuine Christian faith.

Messianic message stirs debate

Kaia, Yorktown, VA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:07:21 GMT

I think most Christians are pretty well aware that there are Jewish texts and prophecies that foretell the coming, death, and resurrection of Christ. Jesus, himself, was Jewish after all, and he was familiar with those scriptures as well. This stone may be something more tangible for many people, but it shouldn't be shocking or surprising.

Messianic message stirs debate

Sharon Baughman Lakeland, Fl. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:07:22 GMT

Born again Christians already know that there is a very close connection to the Jews and the New Testament books in the Bible. Anyone who studies the Old Testament with the desire to see Jesus in the Old Testament, can find Him if they seek Him (Jesus). Just ask the Lord God to show you!!.

Messianic message stirs debate

Steven P. Shindler, Augusta, WV — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:07:31 GMT

The witness of scripture and history is that God revealed Himself first through Israel, than to the whole world through Jesus and His followers. Modern archaeology again bears witness to the historic continuum of biblical faith. Let's put down our religious guards and recognize that true Christianity is Judaic, and true Judaism points to the Christ/Messiah.

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oog — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:07:38 GMT

This is not surprising since any study of Biblical prophecy reveals many references to the coming of the messiah and subsequent events. Regardless of the evidence, faith is required to believe in the Bible or else it would be called science or history not faith. We all continue to view discoveries of this type from our own perspective, are we seeing it as a believer or a non-believer. While interesting and maybe even a little exciting, it will not tilt the world or faith one way or the other.

Messianic message stirs debate

Roger Van Dyk, Knoxville, Tennessee — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:09:45 GMT

This is a very interesting article and architectural find
But there are many references in the Old Testament to a suffering Messiah: perhaps the most famous is in Isaiah 53: 5-6:
"But He was wounded for our transgressions,
He was bruised for our iniquities;
The chastisement for our peace was upon Him,
And by His stripes we are healed.
All we like sheep have gone astray;
We have turned, every one, to his own way;
And the Lord has laid on Him the iniquity of us all."

Jesus is also referred to as the "Passover Lamb"
This is an obvious reference to the blood over the doorposts in the Hebrew Exodus from Egypt.
The sacrifice of Abraham where "God Himself will provide a lamb for the burnt offering"

It is interesting to read this article, but it doesn't affect my Christian faith in the death and resurrection of Christ.

Messianic message stirs debate

Michelle Henry Copley OH — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:09:53 GMT

Like all things that would point to Jesus doing what he said and pointing to who He is...it will be discredited or something...anything so people will not have to be accountable for their actions . One day we will all see the truth. I wouldn't want to be wrong when He does return.

Messianic message stirs debate

Paul R Booth — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:10:18 GMT

Until I see some-thing,that, more than less confirms whats already proven. . . . I beleive it's antique
of the MONTHS sale... marketed for...for rich fools,
naysayers and silly people. Wanting this to be some-
thing its not...like all the other---hersy for sale...

Messianic message stirs debate

larry, durant, ok — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:11:37 GMT

I dont think this is anything that amazing...I mean, yeah its cool that we found this ancient artifact, but there are MANY religions both before and after christianity that have a messiah who dies and rises 3 days later. Just watch zeitgiestmovie.com sit through the first 10 mins or so until it gets good on the religion part, then it starts to explain it all.

Messianic message stirs debate

Rev.Lonnie Wadsworth Springville,Alabama — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:12:54 GMT

I think it is interesting that so called biblical scholars continue to look for proof to justify their unbelief of who the Messiah was & is. Due to the fact,that most of us have a difficult time in trying to live out the message of the New Testament,this new,so-called,enlightened liberal biblical scholarship want to try to persuade believers that their Messiah wasn't real & what was previously written about Jesus was some type of fairy tale.Just because the Christian life demands total dedication,doesn't justfy liberal theologians to try to humanize or discredit Jesus,due to their own guilt,because they don't find that they are able to live a Christian life.Just like some folks don't believe that there is a literal hell.It want change the temperature one degree when you arrive there!

Messianic message stirs debate

Mark Thieme — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:13:44 GMT

Religion is a human construct reflecting constructed history, culture, and rooted in psychology to fit the needs of humanity at given times and places.

Archaeological discoveries have a way of casting doubt on, or re-imagining, prevailing mythologies.

Mythology is always true so long as it is useful. Thus mythology evolves as does every other human construct: Ever-changing to fit new "knowledge" or discoveries.

Sadly, what is lost in all this overheated speculation is that scripture has both a macrocosmic sense, in which the great themes of existence itself are "explained" and a microcosmic, inner meaning which is most "personal."

Therefore there is the Buddha in you and me... the Christ in even the least. This inner meaning of scripture reflects the great archetypal Armageddon that is fought in every moment of human life. Buddha is always being enlightened, Christ is always being born... Buddha suffers, Christ is crucified... in every moment.

The paradox is not merely the historical vis-a-vis the mythical, it is that we are not, in fact, riven by two powers, rather the creative process, birth and death in every moment, is the mystery and the glory of consciousness of the universe, of all the endless universes.

Scriptures are diminished by literal translation which reduces their importance to a narrow time and place... an attempt to "stop the bus," with a final word. The bus never stops at our whim.

This ride is on to the beyond, beyond the beyond, beyond the limitations of human manipulation, no matter how honorable the intention.

Messianic message stirs debate

Larry Hill — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:15:34 GMT

In Acts 3:13-24 Peter tells the jews of his day that Jesus was the Messiah spoken of by all previous prophets. That makes the "Vision of Gabriel" interesting but not earth shaking.

Two of Jesus disciples on the road to Emmaus, after Jesus' death and resurrection, without knowing they were speaking to Jesus, spoke of how they "trusted that it had been he which should have redeemed Israel." The resurrected Jesus then told them "slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken...and beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself". (See Luke 24:21,25-27)

In the Book of Mormon account of the Resurrected Christ's visit to the Ancient American continent, Jesus tells the people "I am Jesus Christ, whom the prophets testified shall come into the world...come forth unto me, that ye may thrust your hands into my side, and also that ye may feel the prints of the nails in my hands and in my feet, that ye may know that I am the God of Israel, and the God of the whole earth, and have been slain for the sins of the whole world." (See 3 Nephi 11:10-17)

There are many who believe that the prophets of the Old Testament testified of a Messiah, who Christ claimed to be. His resurrection and appearance to his disciples on two continents confirm that.

Messianic message stirs debate

Bill Holz — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:17:04 GMT

It never ceases to amaze me how academians (yes even so called scholars) will take something like this and begin to "fill in the blanks" to support their theological view point in the name of objective truth seeking. Perhaps evaluation and commentary should be left up to those who don't have an agenda.

Messianic message stirs debate

Mathew Morais, Petaling Jaya, Selangor, Malaysia — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:17:49 GMT

This is interesting,and could further shed light on the origins of Christianity, especially the gospels which accent on the resurection of Christ after three days.

Messianic message stirs debate

Lorraine Dusseau — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:19:11 GMT

This is amazing. If it is proven true, It'll be more evidence to support what Christians already believe without visible evidence. I hope it"ll be handled better than the "Shoud of Turin." ( A retangular white cloth believed to be the burial shroud of Jesus).

Messianic message stirs debate

Al and Tricia Angelone, Orangevale, CA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:19:33 GMT

Alpha Omega, Jesus is the true messiah and all biblical references point to Him. Man's ways are not God's ways. Man is finite and God is infinite. Our limited expectations fall short from God's plans.

True,Jews wanted a conquerer to the Roman regime, but folks, Jesus was a conquerer to so much more...he conquered sin for us...We must ask ourselves The question....Will I accept Jesus as my Saviour? We know we do not deserve Him. For some reason Jesus loves us all so much.

What do you or I have to lose if we dont believe? Nothing. What do we have to gain if we believe? Eternity in Heaven. Search the Holy Scriptures.

Messianic message stirs debate

Guido Cedolia — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:19:56 GMT

Even without the tablet, the Word of God confirms within the old testament or Torah and further confirms the idea of a suffering messiah. No other proof is necessary. For the doubting Thomases even if you raised the dead most would not believe. The wheat shall continue to grow among the tares, until HIS eventual return.

Messianic message stirs debate

e.sounds — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:24:10 GMT

The root of Christianity is Judaism... then it is no surprise that we would find parallel thoughts between the two... Jesus was a Jew... that has never been questioned. Faith does not need an evidence.

Messianic message stirs debate

Gary Hanson — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:24:16 GMT

I see nothing suprizing about Judaic foreshadowing of the messianic story, Christ and the new testiment talk about the old testiment prophesies that were finding proof is Christ's life.

Messianic message stirs debate

Matt, Arlington, TX — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:25:36 GMT

If authentic, this is a great archeologicial find but doesn't translate into "shaking the foundations". Bible believing Christians have believed for centuries in the Jewish roots of our heritage. True Christianity believes that Jesus Christ is the fulfillment of prophecies from the Jewish prophets. This new tablet, if authentic and from God via prophets, will confirm the Bible; both old and new testaments.

Messianic message stirs debate

John, West Palm Beach, FL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:25:41 GMT

I am a gay man who is very analytical. I've read 'The Ressurection" by Hank Hanegraaff and "The Case for Christ" by Lee Stroebel. There is enough secular evidence, including archaeology and eliminating the New Testament, to support the claims and beliefs of Jesus Christ as Messiah. Even if this new finding is authentic, non-believers will fight tooth and nail to debunk it.

Messianic message stirs debate

H. Paez — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:26:04 GMT

It will never be a religious bombshell. The Bible (Old Testament & New Testament) already revealed the Messiah, Jesus Christ. NOthing can change the truth revealed in the Bible about the Messiah.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jeff Longhibler 12289 SW 11th St. Yukon, OK 73099 — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:27:09 GMT

You all are totally lost. Ask Jehovah's Witnesses to explain the correct answers to all these 'dilemmas.'
The Bible does not mince words. Prophesies state that that the Messiah would atone sins. The Jews who rejected (and killed) the messiah would be cut off.
The Scriptures ALWAYS prefigured a way to bring God's purposes to reality. Jesus was that temporary arrangement. He is the promised seed to undo sin!

Messianic message stirs debate

JH — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:27:11 GMT

even the most basic bible studies will teach that scripture is built upon precept after precept,that is what makes a text geniune or false . THE jewish tradition , and THE JEWISH religion has always been present in the new covenant or new testement . Jesus said himself he came not to do away with the law but to FULFILL THE LAW -JESUS HIMSELF SAID " the law and the prophets testify of me ." all through the septunant and torah ( Isaiah -53) the messianic prophicies of JESUS are plainly evident so to say that the theme is untrue -or shocking is erroneous ! that is how you validate scripture -how does it measure up to the old testmentment prophicies. does the scripture weigh against other scripture . i would not accept the book of enoch or apocrapha as scripture ...because it does not keep with sound doctrine and introduces kablistic and Jewish Mystisim.
but to say this new clay tablet reads that the messiah shall live again in three days is consistent with old testiment prophecies and was declared as a true witness account by the apostles. I would say that this tablet if bc was a copy of an earlier prophecy concerning the messiah "CHRIST " AND IF DATED LATER THAN A COPY OF THE ACCOUNT of the reserection of THE MESSIAH JESUS .
EITHER WAY - IT IS ALL A MATTER OF FAITH .
BECAUSE first of all GOD is a rewarder of those who seek him - and in order to seek him ONE must believe that HE IS .
FAITH ....
THE CANNON OF SCRIPTURE LEFT US IN THE KJV IS A PRETTY GOOD REVELATORY GUIDE ......want to know about god -READ THE BIBLE .

Messianic message stirs debate

Dave Crawford, Farmer City, IL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:28:01 GMT

Jesus, the Christ, and His suffering was already fortold centuries earlier by the prophet Isaiah among others. There is no surprise here even if the stone if found to be authentic.

Messianic message stirs debate

Sherrill Quinn — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:28:19 GMT

I pray that it is proved true. Ultimately, maybe really bringing the Christian and Jewish faiths together. But I'm afraid that the perpetual power, ego-driven, prideful struggles will continue. We'll be left with constant doubts and debates and fights over the issue-again and still missing the whole point of religious faith. Believing in the true ultimate, unconditional love that we are meant to experience. I can only imagine if the world really did come to believe in the one good love, within reach, yet illusive when ego-pride has it's say. I hope this discovery continues the debate and opens up more dialog into the real possibility. Maybe if no one on earth had finacial or power postion stake in either outcome we could find the truth.

Messianic message stirs debate

David Ze. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:28:53 GMT

I do not understand why should this tablet or any other which may be unearthed in the future cause any kind of a surprize regarding the claims of christianity to anyone? The Old Testament(the jewish scriptures)have more than sufficient prophecies about the first and the second advent of the Messiah. All one has to do, jew or gentile, scholar or layman, is to search the scriptures as the Bereians did after hearing Paul the apostle's preaching. They were jews who after hearing that the crucified and resurrected jew was actully the promised Messiah of the Old Teastamet. As a former Muslim who rejected the Messiahship(according to the Scriptures)of Jesus of Nazareth, learned after looking into His cliams in the New Testament and comparing them with prophecies of the Old Tesament, I also came to the same conclusion that He is truly the promised Messiah who was born of a virgin , suffered under Pontius Pilate, died and rose on the third day. And his death, burial and resurrection was exactly as was prophesied by Isaiah the prophet one among many Jewish prophets. No! no surprize, but more confirmation of the already revealed truth about Him. Any one can search for himself. What are you waiting for?

Messianic message stirs debate

AlaskanWindSong — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:29:16 GMT

It will likely remain whatever any individual wants it to be. It's a chicken or the egg saga that still requires faith from man.

Secular scholars will continue to hold that Biblical traditions are the result of other mythologies. People of the Judeo-Christian faith will continue to hold that those other mythologies stem from the fragmented truths that were scattered after the time of Noah (or Babel, or pick the story that each individual prefers, based on their personal understanding of a Biblical world view in a time when most people's limited understanding of the Bible is shadowed only by their lack of understanding of doctrinal and religious history).

What it will mean to scholars is equally vague... it is, after all, a world of post modern religion.

Messianic message stirs debate

John — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:29:19 GMT

This is so fantastic. I have put a book online for all to read named "The Redemption Dynamics of the Soul, the 'Adam the Woman Havvah and the Man the Times Appointed to the Patriarchs unto the End of Time the Mind of 'El" and I think you will find this book truly remarkable. Go to www.redemptiondynamics.com to get it. This is the stuff that makes life interesting. This work shows that YHWH is truly in complete control of our world.

Messianic message stirs debate

mark, dayton ohio — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:30:58 GMT

Whether one believes in the Bible as factual, one cannot neglect the interesting way the Bible prophecies of the Jewish messiah seems to all come true through this man Jesus of Nazareth. There are interesting arguments on both sides, but I tend to lean toward the logic that Jesus probably did resurrect. Much historical evidence seems to point to this...

Messianic message stirs debate

Tim Weaver, Vegaslaughmannv@iwon.com — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:31:14 GMT

Bible = fairy tale

Messianic message stirs debate

Linda Scanlan, Burleson, TX — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:32:15 GMT

It may surprise some that everything Jesus did on the earth was done under the Jewish covenant..there were no Christians then. And to answer someone in the above comments.. the Gospels WERE written by eyewitness accounts. I would think Matthew, Mark, Luke and John knew a little bit about their Messiah.

Messianic message stirs debate

Columbus Banks — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:32:18 GMT

Alan Boyle,

Perhaps, this will help. Jesus' death, burial, and resurrection is not something that one can convince another via intellectual discourse - neither Christian nor Jew. To attempt to do so is an exercise in futility; i.e., all vanity - a waste of time. Spiritual things are only spiritually (not intellectually) discerned, and even that (spiritual discernment) can only occur by the will of God the Father and taught or imparted by the Spirit of God.

I often find it interesting that those who say that they pray will not ask God to prove to them that: 1) Jesus died for our sins, according to the scriptures, 2) was buried, and 3) rose again the third day, according to the scriptures. Instead of asking Him this simple question, they'd rather continue engaging in futile, intellectual, archaelogical, theological, and religious (traditions of men) discourse.

Messianic message stirs debate

David, Beaverton, Oregon — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:32:51 GMT

This simply underscores a widely growing acknowledgement that Christianity is a continuation of an ages-old belief system based on astrology and the worship of the Sun. The "after three days you will rise" reference has roots in many ancient religions and philosophies, which in turn inevitably are drawn from references to the Sun as it passes through three days of "death" during the Winter Solstice, only to be reborn and rise again as it passes out of Winter.

Many recent authors have tried to bring this to light, but have been swiftly renounced because it goes against mainstream religion. And yet, there it is, "written in stone" if you will, that the traditional story of a prophet who is resurrected after three days, existed well before the time of Christ.

In the grander scheme of things, this text does indicate a much deeper and well-established set of traditions and beliefs, which predate Christ, and which were co-opted into early Christianity by the Church as a means for the religion to gain acceptance.

It's similar to what happened when Catholocism was introduced (or "force-fed" if you prefer) to the native tribes of South America. By incorporating native lore and religion (a good example being the "Virgin of Guadalupe"), Catholocism was blended with native culture so it could be adopted.

In the end, what matters? Where is the truth, and where is the truth simply conjecture and speculation? It may well be that the truth lies in each of us to decide for ourselves.

Messianic message stirs debate

John Doe, Seattle, Wash. :) — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:34:21 GMT

Consider the message of the stone that was rolled away on the third day.

Messianic message stirs debate

jewellya, Texas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:36:44 GMT

there are prophecies in the old testament (Amos, I believe) that allude to the "right hand of God" and the "suffering servant" who will come to the aide of mankind. I learned this stuff in my first year theology class at a Catholic university. The reconciliation between the "warrior messiah" and the "martyred messiah" is that in a time of political strife, the jewish people lost track of the "Kingdom of God" and focused on their earthly stuggles to be avenged with an earthly kind of justice. That's how it seemed to be explained to me anyway. So all these ideas about messianic roots in pre-Jesus jewish society are nothing new for those who will study christanity in any kind of depth beyond the New Testament.

Messianic message stirs debate

Curata Et Industria, Pea Ridge, AR — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:37:33 GMT

I don't think it will make a difference. There are so many eye witness accounts (extrinsic and intrinsic) to the life of Jesus. Almost the entire New Testament can be reconstructed from external sources- except eleven verses. And from the Egyptian Texts we know that we have 99.5% accuracy of transmission of message (and the mistakes are mispelled words which don't change meaning or context!)
These new findings will join the other archeological findings that support the Accuracy of the Bible. The next most accurate text is the Old Testament from the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Prior to the Dead Sea Scrolls discovery charlitains like Russell and J. Smith used the argument that the Bible was tarnished in some way. They developed what they called 'new revelations" to correct the mistakes in the bible. With the discovery and confirmation of Archeology, and the rebuttal of Smiths Hyroglyphic translations and Russell and Watch tower artistic license in re-interpretation and additions, we can be sure of the Bible as we know it being an accurate translation.

Messianic message stirs debate

Gloria Baum, Depoe Bay, OR — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:37:44 GMT

The stone is said to ". . bear previously unknown prophecies about a Jewish messiah who would rise from the dead in three days." Whatever is previously unknown and new to be learned from this stone, it will be in addition to the many prophecies in HEBREW SCRIPTURES, Tanakh, (Old Testament)which describe the Messiah's birth, life, death and resurrection. . . yes, in three days. Also, we find in the Tanakh the purpose of it all: atonement for sin.

Messianic message stirs debate

Gareth Hougham — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:38:25 GMT

Very interesting for archeology and the history of theology. But, I don't think it will change any lay minds (lay in the sense of non-scholar). As someone we know said "people cling to their faith"...not withstanding evidence to the contrary. And religions themselves (the organisations) generally seem unwilling to continue to probe the origins of their beliefs. I'm no big fan of Catholicism, but they are something of an exception. Their embarrassment over the Copernicus debacle does seem to have opened their eyes a little to the idea of occasional reexamination. (they even went so far as to admit that there may be extraterrestrial beings, and that they may not be burdened like we are by original sin. Good sci-fi material that!) But, the Gabriel stone will have no impact on regular folks.

Messianic message stirs debate

BamaBoy — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:39:36 GMT

It will be interesting to see not only what the evidence shows in the tablet's legitimacy but also in how the established christian church will use it to further beat people into submission, increase their wealth, control votes and capitol hill.

Messianic message stirs debate

David Chan, Gaithersburg, Maryland — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:39:56 GMT

New archeological findings about the Messiah appear left and right but they all contradict to the Christian Bible and will vanish in due time; because they contradict to the unique revelation from the absolute Sovereign about His one and only begotten Son--the Messiah for Jews and Gentiles. The truth about the Messiah needs no human efforts to approve nor can be disproved for it is granted by faith to believers trusting on the Bible. This is a matter of eternal bliss or curse.

Messianic message stirs debate

michael — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:41:25 GMT

What I find interesting is- All comments have pertained to the Earth and its people. Not once has one mentioned the universe, galaxies, the planets... I think it is quite insulting (to God) and quite arrogant (the opposite of meek) to believe that God revolves around 'Us'. How unbelievably ignorant to disregard every other existence except your own. God gave you a brain for a reason.

Messianic message stirs debate

Eric Snipple, Toledo, Ohio — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:42:08 GMT

Ummm....wait, let me check. Yep, it really is 2008 folks. Time to put your folk yore to bed. Sorry to force you into reality, but there was no burning bush, no stone tablets, no ark, no death and resurrection. It was all fairy tale, allegory and fables. Stop sounding so creepy dumb will ya?

Messianic message stirs debate

John U. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:43:58 GMT

Christianity is nothing but warmed over Judaism anyway, something they cooked up so Christians wouldn't look like Jews when the Romans were persecuting Jews. Now it's all morphed into pure neurotic egotism.

Messianic message stirs debate

Fred, La Crosse, WI — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:47:43 GMT

I've seen so many of these types of stories that now, whenever I hear another such bit from the land of religionist hocus pocus, I automatically see dollar signs flash into my eyes. Yep, someone's after some fast and easy cash!

Unfortunately, this scam is doomed to success, like all the others: Suckerville's pious legions can't wait to lap this stuff up. There really is a religious sucker born every minute. Superstitious religious delusions are pushing out reason and science in the American mind: it's back to the Dark

Messianic message stirs debate

Bill Galvin, Boston, MA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:48:52 GMT

God is dead !
Einstein.

Einstein is Dead !
YHWH.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jonathan P — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:48:53 GMT

THE GOSPELS WERE WRITTEN BY PEOPLE WHO NEVER MET CHRIST JESUS. THIS IS TAKEN FROM THE ENCYCLOPEDIA, ABOUT THE BOOK OF MATHEW.

The Christian community traditionally ascribes authorship to Matthew the Evangelist, one of Jesus' twelve Apostles. Augustine of Hippo considered it to be the first gospel written (see synoptic problem), and it appears as the first gospel in most Bibles. Secular scholarship generally agrees it was written by an anonymous non-eyewitness to Jesus' ministry. The author apparently used the Gospel of St. Mark as one source and the hypothetical Q document as another, possibly writing in Antioch, c 80-85[1] or c 80-90.[2

Messianic message stirs debate

Arlene Zier, College Place, WA 99324 — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:50:20 GMT

Messianic message stirs debate

glenn — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:50:54 GMT

Daniel said,"The day they'll find a tablet from 2000 years ago predicting "the coming of Einstein," and his theory of relativity, I'll kneel down and convert."

Didn't the Bible already say this? Doesn't the Bible say, "To God, one day is like 1,000 years and 1,000 years are like one day."
Sounds like Relativity and time dialation to me...

Messianic message stirs debate

S.B. Stein E.B. NJ — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:51:27 GMT

Suffering goes back to the book of Job. The idea of some force coming to correct the world and save the righteous isn't new. Almost everytime there is a great evil coming (usually our fellow man), there is an idea that someone will come to save us. You can see that in the Macabee story in Hannukkah or even in the flood story with Noah. How trustworthy are the people who presented this to the world? How far back can they trace who owned it. Where was it discovered? Why are these questions so hard to answer?

Christians (and Muslims to some degree as well) have this notion that they are the be all and end all. The Divine trusted their group most of all to carry on the message. Then maybe these groups can explain why they see fit to kill in the Divine name? Why are Jews the focual point of some of the hate? I think that the Divine wanted us to be most of all eithical in our dealings with our fellow human and learn to understand out world and turn it into a trash heap and pollute it.

Messianic message stirs debate

Sue Hill, Sammamish, Washington — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:52:28 GMT

I don't see why people quoted in this article express surprise. There are many references in O.T. scripture (psalms, isaiah) that point to a dying messiah who would be rejected by people on earth and then rise and reign again. To me, this is yet another similar statement FROM GOD to/through a man who retells the important message by ensuring it is written down for people to see and learn. Jesus specifically said he would destroy 'this temple' (meaning Himself) and raise it up in 3 days. Why does finding a prediction of this surprise people? Regarding the astounded comments about bringing Judiasm and early Christianity closer together... I feel like saying "hello - duh, Judiasm and Christianity are the same story told across time - - doesn't anyone actually read the bible?" Almost all of the early Christians were Jews. Only later after Chrisitanity was taking a foothold among people in Israel did Saul/Paul begin to reach out to gentile peoples. The N.T. is really meaningless without the O.T. as its foundation. There is One God, One Story, One time and eternity, and One human race who are being loved, disciplined, forgiven and saved by their Creator. You can't separate the two stories as if they are divergent and different - they are the same story, being played out in history before us all, and entwined with us all - no matter whether you believe it or don't, or whether you know anything or nothing about Judiasm or Christianity. God knows the heart of each man, woman and child and is working out His plan to bring all who will put their faith in Him and trust Him, to be with Him throughout the eternity He has prepared for us. In this way, the O.T. is similarily meaningless without the fulfillment and prediction of future fulfillment in that One story, which is illumined in the N.T.

Messianic message stirs debate

Bob Miller — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:53:20 GMT

Neither a pastor, nor a priest, nor any book they may be reading, proves anything about GOD, if it exists, than what any of us can figure out on our own. What it all comes down to, is whether we're willing to accept the stories of MEN ( with earthly motivations ) as fact just because they make us feel all warm and cozy inside. GOD IS SANTA CLAUS. Faith by definition is "unmerited belief" - a moronic path to truth that somehow only works where GOD is concerned. Next time you go grocery shopping, try taking it on "faith" that the food is in-date. See how that works out for ya.

Messianic message stirs debate

Paul — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:01:03 GMT

The fact that the Christian and Jewish religions are linked is really nothing new. All one has to do is read about the Knights Templar in order to see how far back these two religions have been linked. The Songs of Solomon was one of the favorite topics of the Templars' leader during his sermons. In fact, Jewish scholars were employed by the Templars in order to translate a number of documents discovered over a thousand years ago,

Messianic message stirs debate

Mark Nelson — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:01:50 GMT

Archeological finds are great, but even if Jesus Christ himself came to you in your own home it will not change you if you are a non-believer. Christ´s gospel is faith-based(ooops). He requires faith on his name and a belief in his life and atonement/resurrection before you will receive a witness thru the Holy Ghost/Spirit. Signs mean nothing to a non-BELIEVER, and will not change his/her ways. Like I said, angels could come down in pillars of great light, but that is not faith, and can later be explained away as a dream or hallucination. Only thru the Holy Spirit can our faith be confirmed and we will have a sure knowledge of the truthfullness of Jesus Christ and his Gospel. God´s ways are not man´s ways and that is why this article was written. Those not familiar with their Heavenly Father will always be perplexed and try to find him thru wordly channels, instead of going straight to the source because of their wordly pride. Do not be a sign-seeker. Live by faith and have it confirmed by the whisperings og the Holy Ghost.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ron Janec Clarendon Hills Illinois — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:02:26 GMT

Sadly, many athiests also accept the "religion" of their parents and continue to believe what their parents taught them without ever really researching what they were taught. Einstein also believed in the "religion" of his parents who wanted nothing to do with religion.

Messianic message stirs debate

Dinah Smith — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:02:45 GMT

Although skeptics will no doubt try to spin the message on the tablet and disprove Jesus' resurrection just as they did immediately following the event, I feel that the tablet, if authentic, and its message is more prophesy about Jesus' resurrection and atonement for the sins of believers, which is most certainly not an idea from hell. Well over 100 prophesies from the Jewish scriptures (Old Testament) were fulfilled in Jesus' birth, life, torture, death, and resurrection. The Bible will prove itself.

Messianic message stirs debate

Peter G.Albers — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:03:42 GMT

We must remember at the time of the Apostles during their period from AD 33 to 100 Christianity was very close to Messianic Judaism of today and that the Roman Catholic Church in 325 AD was built on Constantine's aspiration to expand his empire
so a lot of paganistic doctrines came in such as the asking for the saints to intercede for them which really comes from the prayer to the Greek and Roman gods and goddesses in order to placate the Roman culture and the Papacy of course is a continuation of Caesar and the Roman Empire between AD 33 and 100 Christianity was nothing like it is today it was very Jewish you couldnt tell if you walked into a synagogue or a Christian Church because the customs were the same in those early Christian days

Messianic message stirs debate

Richard Clayton, Woodland Hills, CA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:04:09 GMT

A radio evangelist in Los Angeles, Dr. McGee, once said: "If one could absolutely prove that the Bible is true,we wouldn't need faith." My own father used to say, "I refuse to allow theologians to make my faith complicated." Two good quotations from the past. All of these new findings are interesting, but that's all they are to me...just fascinating.

Messianic message stirs debate

Judy P, Alma, AR — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:05:39 GMT

I am amazed at the ignorance of literate people in America who do not read or study the Holy Bible to "see if these things are so"...of course it was all foretold in the Old Testament..no news in this article.

Messianic message stirs debate

PAW, San Diego, CA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:06:07 GMT

All said, "Gabriels Tablet" is one piece of a great puzzle that we continue to find pieces of. Do we want to scrutinize (micro-analyze) every little piece or do we look at the whole message (macro-analyze) the message of God. Unfortunatley "mans" insecurities give rise to "my religion is right and others wrong."
As a human species we have so much longer to go before we understand the whole message of God and live by it.

Messianic message stirs debate

Shirley Soper — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:06:24 GMT

Looks as though it would fit right in with my bible!!!

Messianic message stirs debate

Dick Hatzenbuhler, Deering, NH — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:06:25 GMT

This is not the first time we have heard people with supposedly new ideas that they thought would be damaging to Christianity. Remember the Da Vinci code, and aside from whether the story had any basis, they made a big deal about how disastrous it would be for Christianity if we found out that Jesus had been married. It says various places in the scriptures that He was born and lived as we live, being like us in all things, so that He could be a merciful and faithful high priest; He was baptized even though He did not need forgiveness for any sins, and allowed Himself to be killed even though He had power to remain alive, so why should we be surprised if He married a wife as we do, as another example of living like us? When I was married, I did not cease to be the son of my father; if Christ is married, He will still be the Son of His Father, and the Christ, the Messiah, the redeemer.

Now we have people showing us ancient scriptures (if it is real) showing that the ancient Israelites knew that they needed a Messiah. This is no change from a lot of what we find in the King James Bible, the translation I am most familiar with. Isaiah in particular has a lot to say about that. Even the Samaritans, or at least one, the woman at the well, said that she knew that Messias cometh, which is called Christ, showing that their scriptures, which we now call the Old Testament, looked forward to the coming of the Messiah. Of course, reading the scriptures did not tell the woman whom she was talking to; note that she was the first to bring up the Messiah: it seems that flesh and blood did not reveal that unto her, but her Father which is in heaven. The Old Testament starts with Genesis, telling about the creation; is it any surprise that He who created man would tell His people about His plans for them, far into the future? He told his servants the prophets the whole future of the earth down to our own time, and they passed the word along to the people; we have nothing to fear from learning more of the word of God, if that is what this writing is - or from any other true source.

Messianic message stirs debate

Bo — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:06:45 GMT

I love when the pseudo intellects and street philosophers refer to Jesus as part of mythology..I find it so amusing..What else can believers expect to hear from those who have NEVER known Jesus...or sadly to say NEVER WILL...Time is running out folks...better make a decision either way...and real soon!!!!!.."For those who do not believe, no explanation is possible...Those who do believe...no explanation is necessary"....

Messianic message stirs debate

Dan, Portland, OR — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:08:47 GMT

This article almost tries to pit Christianity and Judaism against each other... I don't see the issue. Jesus was a Jew, he was sent to fulfill prophecies that were recorded hundred of years earlier in Jewish texts (some of which later became the Old Testament). There is no conflict, and no rewrite. If the tablet is genuine, it appears (short of an indepth, scholarly analysis) to be merely another piece of evidence that Christ was indeed the fulfillment of Jewish prophecy.

I find it sad that the media has once agin demonstrated its propensity for sensationalism by attempting to "shake up" a mainstream world religion with some new evidence (plus pitting two mainstream religions against each other).

Seriously folks, there are a lot of religious people who AREN'T in conflict with one another. Don't believe the hype, we're not all out to kill each other, and "religion" in and of itself isn't the bad guy.

Messianic message stirs debate

Thomas Ashby, Calgary — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:08:48 GMT

Bill Galvin...The "God is Dead" was attributed to Nietzsche not Einstein...

Messianic message stirs debate

Leo Gallegos — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:09:43 GMT

Jesus said in John 14:29 I will tell you of something before it happens so that when it does happen you will believe. Why does he want us to believe?
So we can have hope beyond the grave. Wise up, you agnostics and atheists

Messianic message stirs debate

Tom W, East Fishkill, NY — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:10:18 GMT

Once again, the tale wags the dog. The 'Jesus story' is clearly one that was told to fulfill prophecy, but not in fact the fulfillment of prophecy. The gospels tell the necessary, anticipated stories. And then only those stories that were acceptable were chosen for inclusion in the canon 300 years later. Please, everyone, wake up....for everyone's own good....

Messianic message stirs debate

Thomas Ashby, Calgary — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:10:59 GMT

Bo..."For those who do not believe, no explanation is possible...Those who do believe...no explanation is necessary"

You didn't mention where that was mentioned. It almost sounds like you made it up.

Messianic message stirs debate

Lance D Wausau WI — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:12:16 GMT

Hello friends,

Just today here we find that the Bible once again is accurate and that we may indeed be approaching the fulfilment of the times of the gentiles, where the full number of gentile believers, that is ALL who will be able to be saved before the Jews have a final chance to recongize Him ( Jesus Christ) returns, as scripture says. With this tidbit of historical proof, the Jews are now more than ever up in arms that they should be aware that they missed the first coming of Jesus Christ, and that the next coming marks the end of the world as we know it! They are going to be facing the time known in the Bible as the ''time of Jacob's trouble'' This along with many prophecys coming true according to the Bible should be on the forefront of everone's mind regardless of wheather or not you believe in Jesus Christ as God or not!
Keep your eyes on the middle east, and in particular Israel and Jerusalem, as we are getting very close to the confirmation of the covenant prophesied by Daniel 9-12 in where the anti christ brings world peace through the dividing of the state of Isreal into two seperate regions. This has never been accomplished by anyone in history and when you see this happen you know that the destruction of Jerusalem is only a few years away.
Please pray for me, for as of this writing, Satan has attacked me (again) with a skin disorder for sharing this with you all. If you think that I am kidding you can surely ask my wife about this disease, for it is a thorn in the flesh given to me as a messenger of Satan for the exceedingly great revelations that God has given to me in these last days! I will not be silenced until the the LORD calls me home from the work He has called me to do, and by His will I will do it! Amen.

Messianic message stirs debate

James House, Walnut Creek, CA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:13:10 GMT

And how many angels can dance on the head of a pin? As if any of this matters except to the purveyors of Religion Inc.

Y'all folks done get yer faith based presedent. So tell me, how's that a workin' out fer ya?

Messianic message stirs debate

Judy Schiavone, Lyndhurst, New Jersey — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:14:44 GMT

I need no proof. It's faith. No matter how much proof exists, the non believers will still be non-believers. Those of us with faith need no proof. This will go on and on until we die and are united with Jesus in heaven. We will all then, know the truth as it states in the Good Book, no one can enter the Kingdom of Heaven but through me, Jesus Christ.

Messianic message stirs debate

Gabriel — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:15:33 GMT

There is nothing to prove anymore! Everything has an evidence! God said all you have to do is: believe, trust and obey God and His word!
Behold! God -- which is Jesus Christ is coming soon! And then the end will come!

Messianic message stirs debate

Nada King, Elliston, Va — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:16:56 GMT

The prophecies of Messiah in the old Testament scriptures are evident, and nothing that has been found that confirms this would be surprising. While scholars debate, as they did in time of Jesus, those whose hearts were seeking God, and open to His voice recognized Him. He came into this world shrouded in mystery, discuesed as a little babe, commong into poor family, yet being a King. This is the wisdom of God, to hide Himself from proud and wise, yet rervealing Himself to humble and lowly, that the intents of hearts of men would be manifested. Anyone who reads Isaiah ch.53 with open mind and heart will see Jesus Christ in those writings. God will never allow perfect proof of Himself to be found among secular, science community, because He still deals with menkind through ways that are hidden to the eyes, but only found by faith which comes from seeking Him with the whole heart. That summs it all .

Messianic message stirs debate

pat hammit — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:17:12 GMT

Wow, what a testimony to God, he is telling everyone that what happened with Jesus was real. He is the real Messiah, and the only way to God in life eternal. Praise his name, the Prophets (some people spell this (profits), were listening to God speak and wrote accordingly, Not a fairy tale, as everyone will eventually see. Please don't wait until its too late for you to see the truth of the scriptures. Everyone knows in his heart that God is real, even if they unexhaustively deny it. pat, Texas,

Messianic message stirs debate

Don Taylor, Third Mesa of the Hopi — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:18:11 GMT

"I'm a christian, I believe the bible to be the word of God. If any new discoveries deviate from Gods word, I believe the truth will come forth in time. "Rosalie Payne, Godfrey, Il."

First if you take the bible as text without the other articles, scrolls and gospels you are already missing the point of "G"'s word and message. The bible is a translation by man of "G"'s word through Jesus. It is also based 80% upon the Jewish bible. It was man not Jesus or "G" who wrote the bible and decided on what gospels to include and what to destroy. Simple face, all needs to be read a a whole to hear and understand the word of "G" and the teachings of Jesus, not just what man or church wants you to hear and believe in.

"This stuff with scrolls is nonsense, if you read the Quran and actually with out any bias try to understand Islam as I did , you will see Islam is the true religion. Found The Truth"

Perhaps this person in not aware that Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all come from the same place and are not only related they are interconnected. All three come from Abraham with the jewish text being the main basis for the others, yes even Islam. Plain and simple people we are all of the same faith, there is only one "G" with many names. The sooner we all learn this the sooner we can find a path to peace.

Messianic message stirs debate

Thomas Ashby, Calgary — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:18:15 GMT

Christianity and the life of christ is the biggest delusional lie ever concocted.

Messianic message stirs debate

John Doe — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:18:35 GMT

Religions have come and gone over the thousands of years. Christianity will be like any other religion, it will phase out eventually. what gets me is that most Christians have not even studied Judaism and have no clue that Jesus did not fulfill the role of Messiah, according to Judaism. World peace, Universal knowledge of God, rebuilding of the third temple etc. Christians say Jesus will fulfill these at his second coming, but this is not what the Torah states.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ed, Bangor, Maine — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:19:35 GMT

God's Holy Word attesting to the suffering servant, the Messiah Jesus, and to the soon-coming conquering Lord & King Jesus is genuine, regardless whether this stone tablet is. The fulfillment of God's prophecies, definitely including those regarding His only begotten Son Jesus, should only be shocking to those who reject Jesus as Saviour & Lord.

Messianic message stirs debate

Rod, Canton, OH — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:20:24 GMT

I wanted to respond to a thought about modern Jewish theological thinking that a Rabbi from LA reported. He said that God is one God and that the thought of Father, Son, Holy Spirit (trinity) is where Jews and Christians deviate in their theology.

I've never heard that perspective before. I thought that the Hebrew text in the opening passages of Genesis that in English read "Let US make man in OUR image, after OUR likeness" would lend itself to a theology where God is not a singular person, but at least 2 (or as later clarified from Christianity's perspective 3) personalities/persons. Genesis is also clear that "the Spirit of God moved across the face of the waters" during Creation, whereas God (presumably in some physical form) called out to Adam in the Garden in the cool of the day and found that he was hiding because he was embarrased about being naked. Genesis seems to lend itself to the notion that God himself was at least a Spirit and also physical - so at least 2 persons right from the first couple of passages of the Bible....

Jewish prophecy also predicted the coming of a Messiah (God in bodily form) to rule the earth. Jesus will fulfill this prophecy at his 2nd coming.

So from my perspective Jewish theology outlines the basis for God on the throne, God working in creation as a spirit, and an earthly bodily form appearing in the Garden of Eden, again in the firey furnice with the three Jewish slaves sentence to death (The Bible says 4 men were seen in the flames and none of the 3 sentenced were consumed in the fire - we believe that was Christ sent there to protect/preserve those faithful men from death in the flames - he was seen as a man - a physical body), and in the references to a later coming king/conquerer - the Messiah.

Heck, I should have been a Rabbi!!!

Messianic message stirs debate

Jimmy Crackhorns — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:21:03 GMT

The sun dies on the Southern Cross in the night sky every year, right around December 22...it rests for three days and then is resurrected. Christianity is nothing more than the bastardisation of ancient pagan stories of the stars and the sun. The entire new testiment is the adoption of ancint religions, adding in new concepts (the sun becomes a person, Jesus), many gods were born of virgin, lived to their 30's then died and rose again. Jesus is the sun, the sun of God, the god sun, light of light...that is all. Want to know more? Mankind drank the kool-aid way too long and it's time to go into religious detox.

www . zeitgeistmovie . com

Messianic message stirs debate

Jerry — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:21:22 GMT

Religion= fairy tale.

I've seen this post many times, I have to ask....WHAT KIND OF FAIRY TALE ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? The Bible is full of murder, incest, theiving, adultry, slavery.... Not exactly Cinderella. O.o

Just thought that was a bit funny. =p

Messianic message stirs debate

Russ Wiemers, Rathdrum, ID — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:22:09 GMT

One argument for the date given for the tablet is the use of the divine name. Jewish superstition eventually resulted in omission of the divine name "YHWH" or replacing it with "adonai" or "Lord." If it was written at a later date it would reflect this superstition. Jewish scriptures are full of prophecies that fortell Jesus life and ministry as well as his sacrificial death. There is a definite link between the two.

Messianic message stirs debate

Thomas Ashby, Calgary — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:23:37 GMT

Alan, these kind of stories don't belong in Cosmic Log. Religious archeology is lame science and all it does is bring all these religious fanatics out to spew on your site bout hail mary and the glory of nothing!

Messianic message stirs debate

Sharon Maddax, Seattle, WA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:24:10 GMT

As a Christian, our faith is based on the prophecies of the Old Testament writings and the fulfillment of them in the New Testament. The first believers in Jesus as the Messiah were Jews from all walks of life; rich, poor, young, old, educated, and not educated. These people risked their very lives and many gave them up for the this truth. Our very existence as Believers rests on the prophets of old and the coming of the Messiah. I do not see a contradiction with these early writings, should they turn out to be authentic, and our faith. The reason Christians have such a bond with the nation Israel is due to our belief in and love for the Old and the New Testament writings. This is our "Creator's Handbook".

Messianic message stirs debate

ophiri — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:25:22 GMT

Is it not ironic that we live in a society that has made such astounding technological advances in artificial intelligence,genetic cloning, nanotechnology,etc etc, and can literally resuscitate a dead person to life, and yet we refuse to face the possibility of the existence of a being a billion times smarter than us that could have designed and made us? Why do we look to ancient inscription found on a piece of rock fro answers, when the answer is within us? "then God said, let us make man in our own image....."

Messianic message stirs debate

john — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:26:00 GMT

It would be great if bloggers could spell. So much for our (American) English education.

Messianic message stirs debate

Alicia S, Moses Lake WA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:27:57 GMT

Jesus was Jewish. Christians used to be Jews before Jesus came. So those who chose to follow him called themselves CHRISTians, but they were technically still Jewish. I don't understand why modern Jews don't believe that the messiah has already come and that he is Jesus. This stone, authentic or not, is no new discovery. But all truth will be revealed soon enough. I hope I'm still here when it happens, ya know- the second coming. That would be awesome... To get taken up to heaven and see people one by one realize the truth that was right in front of them all this time.. and to see many more people become saved even in the years of suffering that await...

Messianic message stirs debate

A.S. , Moses Lake, WA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:29:19 GMT

Messianic message stirs debate

Michael Wang, NY, NY — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:30:24 GMT

Nothing will change. Those that are religious and believe in the Bible, and God, and Jesus will continue to do with (albeit with a more confident stride). Those who disbelieve will also continue to reject religion. For all we know it could've been someone ridiculously bored that wrote on that rock. No one said religion was rational.

I'm pretty sure if I wrote some crazy story about how the world might be like in the future, perhaps a few hundred years from now, it'll become a religion of its own.

Messianic message stirs debate

Tom Williamson, Richmond, Va — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:30:38 GMT

Let's get real and stopped pondering and theologizing about things that should be relegated to the file marked "Much ado about nothing." Ditto to "yawn."

Messianic message stirs debate

Kelly, Denver, CO — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:32:03 GMT

First of all, I think the author is a little confused on Christian theology. I would be interested in reading why he feels there will be a conflict. Secondly, I'm saddened and encouraged by many of the posts. Saddened by those who choose to remain ignorant, and encouraged by those who choose FAITH. I find it interesting that those who choose ignorance often have second thoughts when faced with a personal crisis. However, this is still a blessing when those who were blind to Christ begin to see. I am one of those people and so glad I did.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jerry — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:33:22 GMT

Alicia S, Moses Lake WA
~~~~~~~~~

I grew up in Moses Lake! What a small world. =o

Messianic message stirs debate

George, Changsha China — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:33:23 GMT

Dasiy, AZ: "...there are none so blind as those who refuse to see," Perhaps, you should consider that there are none so blind as those who only see what they wish to see! Throw away the words and indeed you may find God!

Messianic message stirs debate

frances — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:34:38 GMT

I doubt that there are any Christians who would dispute that Jesus was born a Jew lived as Jew and died as a Jew. So why does this document deserve all this controversy? It simply appears to be just one more "fore"telling of the things that were to be and of the sacrifices that God ( as the father ) and Jesus ( as the son ) were to endure. And further ( to my eye ) just more proof of God the father, God the son,and yes, God the Holy Ghost. The trinity.

Messianic message stirs debate

glenn — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:35:31 GMT

Thomas Ashby writes: "Christianity and the life of christ is the biggest delusional lie ever concocted."

Lol, like the many Believers from Jesus to 350 AD. Then Christianity and God's message of Love becoming the official religion of one of our species great empires. then, with little impediments, Christianity being laid on the hearts of people in countries thru our darkest hours.
Even secularism and the rise of democracy (the 1st Amendment) couldn't stop this "delusion" from making over 75% the populace of the world's strongest nation believe and have faith in a loving, compassionate Saviour.
And before you start to complain, "Why is God so loving when there's so much suffering in the world," I challenge you to ask yourself instead, "Why is there so much love in the world? Why do wars really end up like the end of a Hollywood movie? If man had his way, Hitler would be ruling our entire species. But that didn't happen. Good prevailed. But why?
With a species so prone to evil deeds, why does Good always seem to get the upper hand all the time?"
The answer, of course, is self-evident.

Messianic message stirs debate

Deb Sargeant.so amboy nj — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:35:56 GMT

I'm just greatful to have read this story on MSNBC SCIENCE. It's the first Iv'e heard of this tablet. Keep up the dialog & we all can learn something new. (if we choose to keep our minds open)

Messianic message stirs debate

Ron, Milwaukee Wisconsin — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:36:01 GMT

I find this discovery very interesting and exciting (if indeed it is verified and validated). In the gospels it is often stated, in regard to Jesus' resurrection: "and Jesus arose on the third day 'according to the scriptures.'" I've always wondered "what scriptures?" There hasn't really been that much in Old (First) Testament writings apart from a few of the prophets (e.g. Daniel,Ezekial,Esra, hints in Malachi)that refer to resurrection, let alone a dying messiah (except of course for the suffering servant of Isiah). The psalms seem to have some allusions to resurrection or being saved from death. But the prophets and psalms are think are more oblique on the subject of resurrection. Could the "Vision of Gabriel" and other texts, unknown to us at this point, be the "scriptures" alluded to in the gospels that refer to resurrection, and give the context for Christ's own resurrection ("according to the scriptures!")? Was resurrection theology much more developed at that time than we give the first century BC/BCE credit for? As a Catholic Christian (trying to keep an open mind), this discovery doesn't have to weaken my faith at all. It gives context to gospels that wasn't there before that I've been looking for, for a long time. This find makes direct discussion of resurrection among 1st century jews very plausible, and not some sort of literary device added a century later by Christians editing the gospels to symbolize the growth of the Jesus movement, as some of the Jesus scholars would have us believe. The good news just wasn't plucked out of the air/invented later, for posterity's sake. There were expectancies & hope about the messiah with pre-Christian jews,so much so, that a body of elite jews, the Sadduccees, formed a contrarian party at the time to deny post-mortem existance, esp. physical resurrection. They were reacting to something. Possibly, to these these texts, these "scriptures" (writings) that gave substance to the pharisaic hope in resurrection, and context to the Christian experience around Jesus' death/resurrection.

Messianic message stirs debate

C. kirkpatrick, Opelousas, LA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:39:44 GMT

..........it will fizzle out. We already have all the truth set forth in the bible for anyone to read but unfortunately, interest there has fizzled..........

Messianic message stirs debate

J New York, NY — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:41:04 GMT

If this turns out to be a legitimate find, it's not the Christians who will have to revise their world view; it will be the secular scholars who have been assuring us adamantly all this time that there was no pre-Christian notion of a suffering messiah -- as in Isaiah 53-- and that the concept was fabricated after-the-fact by Christians in an attempt to make sense of Jesus' death.

Messianic message stirs debate

Alan Dereschuk — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:41:19 GMT

OK look at who wrote this article, Alan Boyle,, DUH,, he has never had anything good to say about Judism Christianity and Inteligent Design. See the following site for a few of his views, you can see for yourself that he knows nothing about what he is talking about..
http://www.evolutionnews.org/2008/05/msnbcs_alan_boyle_and_sean_b_c.html

Messianic message stirs debate

Jeff — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:43:51 GMT

Susan T San bernardino, Ca (Sent Monday, July 07, 2008 5:34 PM) said, "Even if they prove that it is real...they will never be able to prove if it was written by a genuine profit. I think this is a debate that will last forever."

I just had to comment. I'm sorry. But, I just have to say this. ALL this religious stuff is written for "genuine profit" by people interested in "genuine profit". Many of those folks actually genuinely want to help people. But most simply want to build a nice life and a nice retirement for themselves and family.

The more people these "religious" folks can pull into their con-game the more they can perpetuate this system for those that follow.

If these religious folks truly wanted to be helpful they should stop creating these "beholding" situations. You know, "I'm beholding to you because you fed me when I was broke". Instead they should concentrate on restructuring our broken system of government. First pass the national sales tax; then increase the prebate until poverty no longer exists.

It's quite simple. But then people wouldn't be "beholding" to the Democratic or Republican parties - so I guess that won't happen.

[ALAN ADDS: I corrected the spelling of "prophet" just so that folks don't dwell on that one unfortunate misspelling in an early message. This message cleverly plays off the (now-corrected) misspelling. I may occasionally correct obvious misspellings, but when a goodly number of comments come in, as is the case now, I can't take the time that I'm otherwise able to take to clean up comments. Apologies to those whose messages I have not approved, either because they were too long, or because they went a bit too far in criticizing others' messages, or because they were more of a statement of personal faith rather than a comment on the subject at hand. Heaven knows enough of that flavor of faith has come through as it is.]

Messianic message stirs debate

Christopher Panos, Dallas, TX — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:44:21 GMT

I have never met anyone who has understood the bible. True, a lot have their own take on it, but they are all wildly differing. So, we'll just wait and see how many interpretations arise from this. And, how hard is it for a person to take a prophecy and live it so as to seem like the one they're talking about? Remember, death leaves the story of your own life open to embellishment by others. I'm sure Yeshua is rolling over in his....tomb? But which one.

Messianic message stirs debate

John Long, Edmond, OK — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:44:46 GMT

According to Merriam-Webster, "Faith" is defined as a strong belief in something for which there is no proof. So in reality, for people of faith proof has no bearing on their beliefs because no amount of proof would change what they think.

Messianic message stirs debate

ron — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:45:16 GMT

WHAT IS KEY HERE IS THAT THIS TEXT CLAIMS THAT THE PROPHET WOULD RISE FROM THE DEAD ON THE 3RD DAY. ONLY CHRIST, ONLY CHRIST, NO ONE ELSE EVER HAS CLAIMED TO HAVE POWER OVER DEATH. CHRIST SAVES MEN FROM THE CONSEQUENCES OF ADAM'S TRANSGRESSION IN THE GARDEN OF EDEN. CALL THIS FAIRY TALES ALL YOU WANT TO, BUT I HAVE NEWS FOR YOU. YOU MAY BE THE SMARTEST MAN OR WOMAN IN THE WORLD, BUT WITHOUT CHRIST YOU HAVE NO MEANS TO HAVE HOPE THAT THIS LIFE HAS ANY PURPOSE. NO HOPE OF AN AFTER LIFE. WHEN IT IS DONE ITS DONE. HOW CRAZY IS THAT!
ONLY CHRIST SAVES US FROM DEATH, ONLY CHRIST CAN BRING US TO THE FATHER. WHY NOT HOPE IN CHRIST? AT LEAST YOU LIVE HOPEFULLY, JOYFULLY WHILE THE ATHIESTIC INTELLECTUAL BOASTS "I HAVE NO HOPE, WHEN WE DIE WE ARE NO MORE- BUT HEY, I AM RIGHT"!!!!
THERE WILL BE OTHER RECORDS NOT INCLUDED IN THE BIBLE WHICH WILL COME FORTH AND TESTIFY OF GOD'S BELOVED SON. THE MESSIAH BELONGS TO THE JEWS. THE BIBLE IS THEIR BOOK, NOT THE CHRISTIANS. SOME CHRISTIANS TODAY SAY 'A BIBLE, A BIBLE WE HAVE A BIBLE" AND WHERE DID YOU GET YOUR BIBLE? FROM THE JEWS. AND WHAT THANK YE THE JEWS FOR THE BIBLE YE HAVE RECIEVED? CHRIST WAS A JEW. THE PROPHETS WERE JEWS, WE MUST BELIEVE THE RELIGON OF THE JEWS FIRST, BEFORE WE CAN BELIEVE ANY CHRISTIAN RELIGION. ADDITIONAL WITNESSES OF CHRIST WILL SURFACE, THIS MAY OR MAY NOT BE ONE.

Messianic message stirs debate

Friday Okure, Henderson, TN — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:46:00 GMT

There is only one extraordinarily historical Jesus and this stone comfirms that he is indeed the Messiah. But we need to divert attention from this stone;present and proclaim Jesus and his saving power to the lost world according to Scripture.

Messianic message stirs debate

Bonnie Crawford — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:46:29 GMT

The "Vision of Gabriel" stone is an exciting discovery. However, it's authencity is the main question and to ensure it isn't just another hoax. The Christian walk is based on a personal relationship with Christ, and faith in the Word of God. I'm not sure why people keep seeking and searching beyond the scriptures in the Bible for verification. It's prophicies are unfolding before our eyes daily. Religious studies were my major in college, and I learned that all religions basically teach that men should live peacefully with other men. But without the Holy Spirit of God indwelling the human vessel and changing of the heart to one of compassion, love and forgiveness, it appears impossible. We fight constantly! Most people are self absorbed and selfish. The spirits of greed, racial hatred, wars, the lust of eye, the lust of the flesh and the pride of life are destroying our species. Yet we have a loving Creator who sent His son to die for a sinful world. He gives us signs along way, and perhaps this stone is just another sign. We have had so many warnings, so many examples in the scriptures, so much wisdom passed down to us through the ages, but we do not take heed. Our time on earth is so very short. We should cherish and savor every moment. People should practice a mutual respect for one another and common courtesy. If we aren't praticing common civility we have chosen a violent way of life.

Messianic message stirs debate

D. Goodell Boston Mass — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:47:26 GMT

As a Historian I am interested in this story. As an atheist I simply say all religions are myths, get over it and take responsibility for your life!

Messianic message stirs debate

Nick Gisler — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:48:50 GMT

For what it's worth----the written word is power--and yet,read into it what you will---words can mean many different things--to many different people. When,and if something actually written by Jesus is found and proven real---all of this stuff is what it is.Just a story. Period.

Messianic message stirs debate

John, Texas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:49:50 GMT

This screams forgery to me. The fact that it was "found near Jordan's Dead Sea shore and sold by a Jordanian dealer to Israeli-Swiss collector David Jeselsohn a decade ago" is the most damaging evidence against it. Just like the "James Ossuary" and "Lost Tomb of Jesus" were both found by unknown people and mysteriously sold (for profit) to antiquities dealers and later proven to be elaborate hoaxes.

And ink written on stone??? The ONLY rationale I could see behind that is that it was never completed. Like it was written on there as a template, with the intent of being inscribed soon thereafter. I'd carbon date the ink and patina on the stone.

Even if it is proven to be from first century B.C., it really isn't shocking. The first Christians were Jews. In fact Christians were required to be Jewish at first, until they started accepting Non-Jews into the faith.

But all the evidence in the world can't make a person have faith. If you rely on it for your faith, you really have none.

Messianic message stirs debate

panchovilla, Houston Texas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:51:11 GMT

Too bad I lack the hipocrecy to go into the religion business because that's a great business. Rick from Ohio is right. For those of us who don't believe in religious lies who can we vote for?

Messianic message stirs debate

the woman at the well — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:56:37 GMT

Fairytale? As if the Big Bang theory and monkeys turning into men is nonfiction?

Messianic message stirs debate

Joey P North Wildwood NJ. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:56:59 GMT

They shall allow us to know what they feel we would be most comfortable in knowing/understanding. There is to large of a bubble to burst, to much money to lose, and what would happen to all the hatred some hold within against others due to ones belief. before you know it, we might live in tranquility and peace ,O MY GOD !!!! What wold the world do then ?

Messianic message stirs debate

Bobby L., Kinston, AL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:58:54 GMT

It dosen't matter what was found or where it was found. It dosen't matter if it is real or not real. Bottom line is that 99% of all religions have been so screwed up over the centuries by this teaching or that teaching,(by men for personal gain) nothing makes much sence any more. Best I can figure is that we are all HELL bound and there is nothing we can do to stop it.

Messianic message stirs debate

Mark Thieme — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:58:54 GMT

I might add to my earlier post that what is true about religion in terms of presenting practical mythologies is also appropriate to "science," which itself is a subset of religion with its own mythology, scripture, and faith statements.

Thus "science" is justifiably understood as "a human construct reflecting constructed history, culture, and rooted in psychology to fit the needs of humanity at given times and places."

Messianic message stirs debate

Jerry — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 02:59:47 GMT

Good for you, Kelly. However, faith is not for every one. I would respect any person's personal beliefs, whether they are Christian, LDS, Muslim, aithiest, Cathloic, or worship apple pie. MMMmmm, pie.

Messianic message stirs debate

mike , Conway, SC — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:00:42 GMT

I find it interesting that this stone has the elements of what I Corinthians 15:3-4 calls the Gospel of Jesus Christ - death, burial and resurrection.These are easily seen in many examples of the Old Test. writings and referred to by the New Testament writers. Many times the Apostle Paul (well versed in the O.T.) ties the O.T. to the Christain beliefs of death on cross = repentance, burial = baptism and resurrection = infilling of Holy Ghost. It will be interesting to see what the Jewish archaologists think of the stone compared to Christian ones.

Messianic message stirs debate

David, Abilene, Texas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:01:23 GMT

Why is this a "bombshell" ? The ENTIRE Old Testament is a foreshadowing of the coming of the Messiah. Remember: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word WAS God, and the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. Who was that 4th man dancing in the fire with Daniel and company? Get in the scriptures folks and pray for the revelation of the Spirit and God's enlightenment. It's a promise of God that all will be revealed.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jim San Diego — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:06:20 GMT

The messanianic message goes back even further. Mithra - was born 1600 years before Jesus and he healed the sick and raised the dead, and died for the salvation of all mankind, and was the Son of God. And before him Orsis - Eqyptian. It's a fairy-tale that probably goes back to the beginning of humanity.

Messianic message stirs debate

Marcus, Phila., PA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:09:02 GMT

"... while skeptics might say the text provides more evidence that the gospels fit into a tradition of untrue messianic tales."
Aren't these so-called "scholars" aware of the over 300 messianic prophecies found in the old testament that describe the expected messiah in almost every way, including his role as the "suffering servant" who must die to atone for man's sins. The "suffering servant prophecies are most forcefully seen in Zech 12:9-14, 13:6-7, Isaiah 53, & psalm 22. According to Risto Santala, author of "The Messiah in the Old Testament (in Light of Rabbinical Writings)", there are 456 prophecies concerning Christ in the OT. Of these 75 are found in the Pentateuch, 243 in the prophets, and 138 in the "writings" and psalms. Neither Jesus nor his apsotles could have artificially arranged all of these details to fit the historically-known facts about Jesus. And why would nearly all of the apostles and subsequent martyrs willingly go to their torturous deaths for a known lie?

Messianic message stirs debate

Ray — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:11:15 GMT

People act as though the Bible is not accredited to this tablet. If you read the bible at all you know about Gabriel, you know about the Resurection. It should not be a shock that the TRUTH is finally becoming evident, non believers will shake the idea of this but we all know it is true.

Messianic message stirs debate

EGW — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:14:20 GMT

For FRITZ and LISA- your childlike belief in the "translations" of the Psalms and etc are quite misguided. It is EVERYWHERE recognised by genuine scholars that these passages as written in the King James are WRONG, that they were mistranslated either deliberately or in ignorance. There is no mention of "piercing" etc. The true translation of the Hebrew is "they were at my feet like a lion (aryeh).
As for DAISY a little further down, all I can say is "G-D BLESS HER, she should stop smoking that stuff.

An important point about the dating IS- that barring other genuine indications of date, there can be no proper dating within, say 50-60 years, perhaps even much more, since the writer could easily have learned (AND FIXED) his writing skills and style in the last, (say) 20 years BCE, and written the tablet in around, say 45-53 CE, perhaps being a Jewish believer in a living and dead Messiah. Alternately, he could have been around, say, even after the destruction of Jerusalem, but had his writing akills and style from an old scribe who had been born, say around 20 BCE. If there were "school" classes then, the whole class would learn the style of the teacher, depending on how old he was. and when HE learned to write. The point I'm making is that there NEEDS to be firm proof. I wouldn't pay any attention to what Herschel Shanks says, he's in the business of selling his magazine, and he really fell for the fake Ossuary box, certifying it in just the same adulatory and convinced terms as now.

Messianic message stirs debate

Tom, Cuba, MO — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:14:50 GMT

there are allot of archaeological finds that back up the bible and the info written in it.It is all true and this find can be added to the proof. We are living in the last days and soon this old system as we know it will come to an end. The bible does not tell the date or day , week or year, but it does give us enough information that we can tell within one mans generation when this will be, and we are well into that generation it tells us. For in 1914 this generation started. The bible has not been wrong yet and and never will be. The words of the bible are for reproving and setting things straight and tells us how we should live our lives and be in hormony with GOD's Holy Word. Im have been chosen to be with him at the end of this system of things and for him to use me as he wills. I have known this sence I was 7 when he came to me and told me HE will always be with me. I was stricken by bulber type polio then and peralized from waist down. I am not today and I walk for him and serve him, and I am guided by him to do his will. Watch the things all around the worl in one place after another and you will see the signs that are happening as told in the Bible. Pings of Distress in one place after another. Jesus told that this is one thing to look for. Beleve these tablets for they are real.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ken, Salem, OR — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:17:07 GMT

I find it shocking that anyone referred to as a "professor" doesn't understand that Jewish scriptures prefigure Christian theology.

Messianic message stirs debate

Animus01, NOLA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:17:35 GMT

Having a personal relationship with Jesus, I know for a fact that He exists by what He has done for me, personally, including countless answered prayers, a growing number of testimonies, and an actual experience in overcoming a demon. This tablet is just another stone in the foundation of my belief in Jesus Christ - The Way, The Truth, and The Life.

Messianic message stirs debate

Vitor, Las Vegas, Nv — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:19:22 GMT

I accidentally found this piece of info. Found it interesting...umm...somewhat!? My personal opinion on this???? Why do I need more "proof", like the so called "theological scholars" and non-believers, to..."believe more" in my Lord and Savior, Jesus....My Messiah???? Gimme a BREAK...plis !!!!!
If my belief is wrong about my Lord...well, I guess I'll just go into the cosmos with the rest of them....but, if my belief is right....WOOOH unto them and their belief!!!!
Humbly
El Vitorioso

Messianic message stirs debate

Hugh Central Texas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:19:30 GMT

Although Isaiah 53 and other passages detail what would happen to Jesus almost 500 years beforehand, most Jewish people were looking for a warrior king with sword on a horse as a savior. Even the apostles didn't fully understand Jesus ultimate purpose of death and resurrection consistently. Although it may seem almost silly musings to think of Jesus as a common man who knew what was written about the Messiah, and therefore tried to imitate each and every event. After all certain detailed events which were prophesized and came to pass - Such as a sword in the side and his unbroken legs at sunset etc...
-do far exceeded a mere profits control, and reveals a God sent to make the ultimate sacrifice and redemption for Mankind. Even a casual study of the old and new Testaments reveal amazing details of what was prophesized about the ultimate event, and the threatened status quo’s attempt to crush the mere mention of this God who was stirring up so much trouble and threatening the religious ranks of control.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jean Jones, Tulsa, Oklahoma — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:23:51 GMT

Recently I have had the priviledge of teaching basic hebrew in a small messianic church. I have never been so blessed as to see how the Jewish Feast all point to Jesus. The knowledge of these Jewish Feast have strengthened my faith in God as a Christian. Finally I have a clear-cut idea of what a Christian is supposed to be doing with the precious gift of "Faith" that we have been given. I truly believe that the "Messiancic Message" is a move of God to finally bring all mankind togehter. It's a tough task but someone or something has got to do it. Who better than Jesus Christ of Nazareth, called the Messiah, the "son of man", the "son of God", the redeemer, the lamb of God, the Saviour, the Prince of Peace, the Mighty God, The everlasting Father, etc.?

Messianic message stirs debate

Sean, MI — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:27:17 GMT

Scott,
It is statements like that which not only prove your ignorance but others like you. Such umbrella claims like 'Even the gospels differ in their accounts' or 'the ones chosen by the "the church" in Rome around 100 AD' prove nothing to nobody. Why?

1. Everything you just said can be proven incorrect (or at least flawed) with brief research. For example, '[M]any religions were founded upon well before that time' is really an inaccurate statement. Firstly, there were NOT many religions which professed a similiar story. Mithra comes to mind, however, it has been shown the myth for that was around or after the time of Jesus, not before (this has to do with the wide variety of religions [and merged religions] known in the Roman culture). Secondly, the only thing that comes close is the Egyptian myth of the Sun god (Ra, Horus, or several other names). Although there is 'compelling' evidence on the Internet, what is more probable is the Messianic prophecies got garbled with Egyptian religions. Further, most of the similiaties shown online can be easily falsified by actaully learning about Horus from the Egyptian texts.

2. Naturally you would expect the gospels to differ slightly in their account as they were written by different authors (and yet, they still tell the same story). Although the deal breaker for your argument is how close the Gospels (and the rest of the New Testament for that matter) were written in proximity to the death and resurrection of Jesus (approx. 10-70 yrs [earliest written manuscripts on file date 25 years from death]).

Good call, GA.

Messianic message stirs debate

Valerie, Toronto, Canada — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:28:44 GMT

We have the Bible that tells us all we need to know. If we study it, we will not be confused by anything else that is found, genuine or not.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jon, Okinawa, Japan — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:29:29 GMT

When is the bible going to be denounced for what it really is? a fairy tale
deedee (Sent Monday, July 07, 2008 7:23 PM)

Deedee the Bible will not be denounced for it is not a fairy tale. MATTHEW 24:35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away. (Jesus) I wonder how He could of known we would still have His word in todays times. I encourage you to honestly search for truth instead of buying the propaganda of the surrounding anti Christian culture. Jon

Messianic message stirs debate

Hank Thomas , BrownsMills, nj — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:29:36 GMT

I see the work of the anti christ here.

Messianic message stirs debate

Marvin Hays, Wellington, FL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:32:14 GMT

To Susan T: FYI, "Profit" is Prophet.

To ahmed zahmed: Your "yawn" reveals much.

To Found The Truth: The Quran was written by a man, who died as all men, and has decayed in the grave. Christ was crucified, shed his sinless blood and rose again the 3rd day, according to the scriptures, and is alive forevermore, sitting at the right hand of the Father on high, pleading intercession for us who believe, and who redeems all fallen, sinful men (anyone) who simply believes in His finished work of the cross. Not works, but simple believing. Eternal life is the reward of those who believe, eternal damnation to those who refuse to believe. Uncomplicated, yet powerfully true. Unbelief is deadly, the unpardonable sin. Why would anyone trust their immortal soul to the fallacy of sinful, mortal men and not the Creator (Jesus Christ) of the universe? Eternity is too late for people to regretfully find they have been wrong.

The bible is clear: "Neither is there salvation in any other (Christ)"..."He that hath the Son hath (present tense) life and he that hath not the Son (of God) hath not life but the wrath of God abideth on him"....Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life; no man cometh unto the Father except by (through) me. Jesus said, "if you have seen me you have seen the Father. Jesus was truly man and truly God....the God Man. No other man in history can make the same claim, except by lying and deceitfulness.

Will you trust your eternal soul to anyone less than Jesus Christ, your only hope and the hope of Glory?
This is not trivial. Your eternal destiny depends on it: nothing less and nothing more.

Messianic message stirs debate

Richard A. Swaney — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:34:59 GMT

Idiots, this tablet is clearly a fraud. The ink would have faded after 2,000 years. Plus,they didn't even have ball point pens in the 1st century AD.

Messianic message stirs debate

Anthony, tyler, tx — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:35:03 GMT

This story is designed to create the reaction it has drawn from ya'll. It's just another "Noah's ark found" story that will come and go with time. But mark my words, the scripture's will be here forever. Some died for them, lived for them, disbelieved them, lied for them killed for them... Look at the signs of the time for they tell no lies.

Messianic message stirs debate

jeffrey — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:36:12 GMT

This discovery along with others are no surprise especially for those who beleive.For in the incident with lazarus and the rich man; when he asked that somone could be sent to warn his family, he was told that they had the prophets. Does that ring a bell? We have being warned so many times but still not taking heed. Does our unbeleive affect the history or the coming of christ?

Messianic message stirs debate

leemac, phoenix, az. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:38:13 GMT

Why should the reported content cause any great shivers in the Christian Community? Many prophesies
addressed the same statements long before Christ..Although the ink on stone (found by the dead sea on 10 or so years ago) seems a bit to fathom ... The tenents of Christianity is not going to fall apart over something that confirms its basic beliefs..

Messianic message stirs debate

Frank Zelasny Allentown PA. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:39:03 GMT

The power of the mind & belief is an amazing & wonderful thing, if one believes in the great flood and sets out to find proof, he will surely find somethings to support his belief, in the same manner if one sets out to disprove the flood or any other historical event, his mind & power of belief will cause him to find no evidence of the event. That is what is meant by "Seek & you shall find" "Believe & so shall be done unto you." Life is both wonderful & amazing.

Messianic message stirs debate

Steve, Belleville, Il — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:39:27 GMT

Please check out the english translation of the text. It's so fragmented, it seems like gibberish. I'm not sure how it could shed much light on anything wether it's deemed authentic or not.

Messianic message stirs debate

Bloggerrich — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:43:41 GMT

I could spend all night reading these entries and some are very entertaining. However, I can't understand why people...mostly intelligent...still believe in some all powerful being. I saw a movie the other day in which Morgan Freeman's character says god is an imaginary friend for adults. I'd have to agree with that one. All this stuff is great history, but when taken and used by "the faithful", it basically gets twisted out of proportion. The people who wrote this stuff were barely out of the cave and you can't expect that they understood all that was happening to them. If all these scrolls and tablets were created by people who had contact with god or god's son or whatever, don't you think god would have simply burned the crap on a dvd to be found by someone 2000 years later. Also, why would god let people hurt each other and destroy the planet? The "faithful" always have some kind of bs answer justifying why god doesn't do anything to make everyone know he really exists. God surely doesn't stop us from killing each other and destoying the planet because god doesn't exist. When the faithful wake up from their self induced primitive ignorance, they might just figure out that we are responsible for everything on this planet because we evolved to be the top of the food chain.

Also, there is no doubt that we may all go extinct one day...comet, meteor, world war, sun going supernova, alien invasion. One thing is for sure. It will have absolutely nothing to do with god. Then who will give a crap about tablets, scrolls or anything?

Messianic message stirs debate

ED, Middlefield, Ohio — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:48:25 GMT

This stone won't amount to anything. Consider other relgion's claims to have Messiahs. There were many Messiahs before Yehoshua of Natzereit and Shimon bar Kochba. Consider Horus of Egypt..same story of "Christ".

Messianic message stirs debate

Lorna Doone, St. Louis, MO — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:50:16 GMT

Evidence that Demands a Verdict; Josh McDowell. Those who claim that these religions are "fairy tales" should check out this book -- or are they afraid to analyze the evidence logically? I believe they are afraid that the evidence would truly shake their faith in atheism, the religion that is most deeply pervades our current government. "Congress shall pass no law which. . .hinders the free expression of religion." This first amendment has been used largely to hinder of free expression of religion. Amazing that our proudly "tolerant" society is afraid of those with actual beliefs.

Messianic message stirs debate

tman — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:55:16 GMT

their are no suprises with this tablet. nearly every story written about jesus so called miracles was borrowed either from an earlier jewish story, or from greek mythology. this has been researched over and over. most scholars ref: "jesus seminar";ref: "god who wasnt there" don't believe any of the miracles in the new testament ever occurred.if jesus did perform miracles why would these stories all be near carbon copies of events/stories that were written of other characters before? sounds like the writers of the new testament really were just not all that creative.

Messianic message stirs debate

ED, Middlefield, Ohio — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 03:55:56 GMT

This stone will bring nothing new. Just more arguing. The whole "CHRIST" theology is a wash compared to the other "Christs" that came before Jesus. Compare Egyptian Horus to Jesus the Christ and see the common facts. http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jcpa5.htm

Messianic message stirs debate

Big Sky — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:01:01 GMT

All theologians already knew this, its only "shocking to the general public" It is no secret that all religions are revamped mythology.

Messianic message stirs debate

southerneyes — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:04:31 GMT

I'd like to just say to all of you who think this a boring subject or a hopeless endeavor, be thankful you have Jesus in your life. If you think you don't have Jesus in your life you are truely blind and unaware of the peace and fortune he has brought you by his death. Jews would have long been erased from the earth if not for the guidance of the words from his parable's. If not for Jesus, the world of Islam would be Hindu, and lost in history as conquest. If we all think of a Roman civilivation, prospering another 1000yrs past it's fall, what do we see? No dark age, no awakening, no crusades, virtually nothing that defines the world as we know it. And what is this world without Jesus? A little China mixed with a little Khmer Rouge with a British accent? Remember that at the time of His death, dis-emboweling a man for stealing food was Okay. What would we be doing for an impact by now? Without the true moral compass that is only found in Jesus, Islam would be the only peaceful religion. Thats scary.

Messianic message stirs debate

tman — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:05:17 GMT

it makes sense that the writings of the new testament regarding jesus and his life were just borrowed stories from greek mythology and jewish culture. the men writing the new testament were not writers by trade. its easier to rewrite old stories than to come up with a completely new one. they wanted to add miracle stories to their simpler human jesus to make him more interesting and palatable to the jews who were in desparate need of a messiah. especially after so many lost battles against the romans.

Messianic message stirs debate

Chicago, IL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:09:00 GMT

Everyone should just calm down and take a breath. Read between the lines. This "new discovery" is a FAKE plain and simple and the reality that this stone tablet is a fake will be seen.

Messianic message stirs debate

Matt, PJ, Selangor, Malaysia — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:28:01 GMT

On the other hand, do we need all this 'evidence' to prove that Jesus Christ really exists? I believe He does, and so must the world - to be resurected from its many calamities.

Messianic message stirs debate

G Jones Marietta GA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:30:53 GMT

The message of Jesus was that the divine was obtainable by anyone who placed God first, and Jesus displayed divine higher self in action but always gave credit to God and not himself. This divine self within is known as higher self and the false man made mind that is concerned with worldly affairs as the lower self. God as master of all and ourselves as nothing except a shadow or object empowered by God and relying on the lower self is suffering and focus on God first is all that is required and that simple.

How the Gabriel rock supports this message that is already supported by many prophets I would hope helps change the perception of mere lipservice to Jesus and Jesus will fix the sins at death is not spiritual and does more harm than good as it promotes importance of the lower self that never will have an impact on the divine no matter what thoughts or actions are taken.
The divine self allows the lower self to operate and the focus needs to be taken inside to place the lower self in the background and allow the divine self to gain control. A long process very private in nature.
Much easier to accept common knowledge that Jesus will be there at death to fix the many sins and many who never feel the need to internalize and interpret for themselves what he said.

So, now on to the Gabriel rock and English translation but I hope thought is given to the 1st Commandment implications that if adhered to, require much more than a belief by a man made identity that is governed by the divine self and has no effect at all on the divine self, no matter what actions are performed or thoughts are believed in.

Closeness with God is rejecting the lower self and placing the lower self in the background allowing the higher self to operate and which is now hidden and a mere trickle and it is a matter of increasing the blend in favor of the higher self which is God within all creatures, including mankind.

Messianic message stirs debate

Alex, Denver, CO — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:33:09 GMT

Did anyone even read the translation? It is COMPLETLY disjointed to the point of being merely language fragments. The 3 days has no direct reference to any resurection, there is no word "messiah" in it- it is a huge stretch to make sense of any of it. I have no idea how anyone could put that together and legitimately come up with a cohesive and believeable way to make this mean what they are claiming it means. You can't put in words that aren't there- there is only so much you can infer.

Messianic message stirs debate

sunny, MD — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:34:38 GMT

GA, it is to indicate to you that, science is just here to explain the process phenomena created by God works, but not to explain why it does what it does and how it all started. this is the problem we having and it is misleading millions. it's like the blind leading the blind, what happens is that both of them will fall in the pit and perish except there is a divine visitation.

Messianic message stirs debate

Michael, Dallas TX — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:34:57 GMT

You people are nuts. Early Christians refered to themselves as Christian Jews because they followed the teachings of Christ but they were firmly Jewish. You are talking about the New Testament like it was writen around the time of Christ. The only problem with that is none of the books of the bible were writen at the time. The earliest "Christian Texts" were excluded from the Bible by the Catholic Church. Look up the Gospels of Mary, yes that Mary, and Thomas. I know you probablly aren't allowed to because they are banned by your churches; Catholics, Baptists, Lutherans... You will find out if you have the courage and do a little research, that Jesus was a man who died on the cross and was thrown into a pile of remains with thousands of other "criminals" long after he had died and the carrion birds feasted on his flesh.

Messianic message stirs debate

E. Iginla, Edmonton, Canada — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:35:21 GMT

This debate is a red herring and divisive. The path to knowledge about God, is found in the heart, in the manner in which we treat others. The purer the heart, the wiser it is and the closer it is to God. If we spent a fraction of the time we spend in debates and acrimony, on learning to love, we would not only be happier, we would see more clearly.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ikie — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:35:28 GMT

The ancient religions in the Middle East were very, very similar, so why would anyone be surprised by this? Look at the similarities of Zoroaster and Jesus for an example, or the "flood story" from Babylon and Ur.

Messianic message stirs debate

aphex, ny, ny — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:39:51 GMT

there have been at least a dozen "messiahs" that came before jesus. http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/ has a movie that will make things too clear for most. the movie is free to watch and enjoy.

Messianic message stirs debate

Dan, Seattle — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:41:05 GMT

I have a stone that looks JUST Like that. I use it to put hot pans on when cooking, and sometime will warm tortilla's on it. If I were to use ochre based pigment dyes and learn a bit of the ancient writing script can I make one too? I wasn't there when it was produced, hidden, found, sold, sold again then made available to the general public from a private collection. I'd suspect that its an authentic rock with some writings on it. But a religious treasure? More of a curiosity at this point.

Messianic message stirs debate

Vitor, Las Vegas, Nv — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:43:53 GMT

Messianic message stirs debate

Isaiah C, Spokane, WA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:48:08 GMT

What no one is asking is the most basic question? Why would someone in the 1st century B.C. carve something into stone when there was papyrus to write on? The answer is equally as simple - it's easier to forge a carving in rock than it is on papyrus.

Messianic message stirs debate

T C Austin, TX — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:50:25 GMT

Perhaps we should rely on the truth which is written by man and inspired by God!!! Are we not living in the end times? Matthew 16:3 "You know how to discern the face of the sky, but you can not discern the signs of the times". What really matters is having a personal relationship With Jesus as Lord and Savior.
Take someone to Heaven with you, share the Good News
JESUS SAVES!!!! My Bible tells Me So

Messianic message stirs debate

Richard Pursell, Poncha Springs, CO — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:53:07 GMT

Anyone with just a cursory reading of the Bible would know that Christianity is a fulfillment of Jewish Old Testament expectations. Whether the tablet real or fake will not change that fact.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ed Herr, Melbourne, FL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:53:21 GMT

Reporters and scientists have to develop stories with shocking claims in order to sell their publications and earn a living. The Roman census and other non christian historic records from 2000 years ago specifically talk about Jesus he was well known and written about. Jews do not believe Jesus is their messiah and Christians absolutely believe Jesus was the son of GOD. We Christians have been telling our Jewish brothers and anyone else who will listen for the past 2000 years that Jesus is the son of the Living GOD and that we are all brothers and sisters.
The writer of this article should ask the scientists in this article why every persons DNA in the world matches one common ancestor? GOD gives us all the option to believe. You have a choice you can either have faith and believe in Jesus and what he preached or you dont have to believe in anything at all. The choice is yours and the debate continues after 2000 years.
GOD Bless you all and we Love you.

Messianic message stirs debate

Thomas Aurora. Colo. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:54:04 GMT

How much pigment was left in the tombs in Egypt?
Was this Ink on Stone as protected as them?

There are still too many questions right now,however.....Ink on Stone???????

Messianic message stirs debate

Wilson C. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:58:12 GMT

The tablet is just another piece of a greater puzzle that is now being assembled by the experts, the puzzle of historic truth. So whatever this tablet may finally contribute to our historic wealth, the end game is that the truth is what really matters in all this, wheather it is to our taste or not.

Messianic message stirs debate

ReturnFormer — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:58:46 GMT

Thats a VERY loose interpretation, to interpret it as referring to jesus. While it mentions three days, it doesnt say in reference to what, contrary to what Knohl would like to believe. Theres no compelling reason to connect this to xianity at all...

Messianic message stirs debate

JH — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:58:47 GMT

i find it very interesting how people will argue against something so good. something that teaches love, faith, honesty, and much much more that is only benefiting. what is so wrong with it. because it isn't tangible? neither is the wind but we still feel it... but yet we argue it doesnt exist or that an artifact will make any difference in the good of the message.

Messianic message stirs debate

rich smyth, Long Island N.Y. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 05:09:25 GMT

if the story of christ's death and reserrection is a hoax, fashioned to fit the prophecy as some infer, then how do you explain that 11 of the original 12 conspirators were tortured and put to death without a single one recanting. Even i wouldn't be that stupid! No, there is something more here than meets the eye. Their witness is more convincing than any stone tablets.

Messianic message stirs debate

Gerry Howell,St.John's NL,Canada — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 05:19:27 GMT

'Jesus' was a good person who walked the earth 2000 years ago,and that's good enough for me.Everything else is irrelevant,comprenda!

Messianic message stirs debate

Leslie K, Corpus Christi, Texas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 05:27:19 GMT

The Old Testament is the Messiah concealed.
The New Testament is the Messiah revealed.

Messianic message stirs debate

Paul, Treasure Coast, FL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 05:44:04 GMT

A messiah to everyday Jews of Jesus' day would have brought them what they didn't know they wanted until they received it or until it was shown to them. At that time, (he) their prayers answered.

Christians today, Jews always, accept and trust in the possibility that great truths have always existed in plain view but mean different things to different people. Their prophets call for them to bring forward from the dust what articles of faith strengthen their belief in great truths. Both religions abhor worship of the dust. Actually, I think all religions (with the exception of some C.E. radical fundamentalist sects or revived modern animists) suggest that lives directed to an honorable future are better lived than lives directed to honor the past.

Messianic message stirs debate

Kenny Grooms, Petal, MS — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 05:48:30 GMT

I'm surprised that MSNBC would suggest that this would have any profound negative effect on Christian belief. The Bible is full of prophesy far older than this and far more specific than this of Christ's coming. It is of no coincidence that the Tora is a also full of prophesy of the coming of a messiah, his death, and his resurrection. Christ was from the lineage of the House of David, and as such, was a Jew. All of the prophesies of his coming were given to the Jews. His coming, death and resurection gave the opportunity of salvation to Jews and Gentiles alike! Christianity and Judaism are not paralleled religions with theological differences. Christianity is the evolution of Judaism as the fulfillment of the afore mentioned prophesy. It is the result of the new Covenant (New Testament), which covers us all!

Messianic message stirs debate

Me bloomington IN — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 06:00:43 GMT

No big deal. Back then, "history" was like what we call a docudrama - you take facts, adjust them so they fit your point, and tell your story. And back then, expectations of a messiah were rife, so if "3 days" was part of it, one would expect that to appear in the "histories". People are still trying to combine the Gospels into a coherent unity for all those reasons.
What's 3 days? The picture is so much larger than that. Even if they can date the ink and prove that authenticity it doesn't mean much. The message goes way past that, and that's the point.
What He said was Right, despite all the subsequent political folderol and machinations, and I try to live that way.
Oh, and I am not a Christian.

Messianic message stirs debate

G Jones Marietta GA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 06:03:28 GMT

Amazing how people fail to take action no matter how many scriptures are read and ignore the one issue that matters which is placing God first in their lives. This requires the person to choose between the false identity, no matter the beliefs, with the true identity, which is none other than God within.
It is a private journey and process that takes time and effort and replacing the outer view with the inner view is unfortunately against the grain and against common knowledge too easy to accept on faith.
Those on this narrow path know what I am talking about and concerns are not based on beliefs learned and valued by the lower self false identity crisis.

Messianic message stirs debate

Dizzo for the Antarctica Cryonic Burial Trust — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 06:09:39 GMT

What Jesus and the Apostles where just ACTORS ? Apparently Jesus and the Apostles had heard of this messiah story and acted out its theme. Don't get me wrong , I think everyone is a baby god with a baby universe but Most leaders in civilization are criminals, from George Washington rebeling against England, Robert E Lee against the United States to St Paul as a murdering prosecuter , even Jesus because he allegedly tipped over the temple money charges bench in protest, " The Danger of Fairy Tales " is a chapter in Basic Principles of Psychoanalysis by Dr Brill 1948. People and children imitate what they read is As a psychoanalyst I am not suprised this story , maybe the missing parts say the Messiah will wave his magic wand and POOF , resurrect the dead ?

Best Wishes , yours for a Medical Resurrection Dizzo

Messianic message stirs debate

P.J. Saucier, Mississippi, USA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 06:19:42 GMT

I cannot wait for a time in mankinds history when there will be no more of this religious nonsense, of people believing in these superstitious fairy tales of a "messiah", and when humankind will finally shed these robes of religious illusion and become secular. That will be the day there truly is peace on earth, when we finally put our fictitious deities aside and concentrate on loving and helping each other, because it is the RIGHT thing to do, not because some fictional book like the bible tells you to do it. Open your minds people, and release these religious shackles!

Messianic message stirs debate

Patrick Bishop, Caldwell, NJ — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 06:24:16 GMT

How old is the ink? What's it made from? Lampblack? Could the ink have datable carbon in it?

If a piece of stone is covered in part by ink for a long enough period of time, shouldn't the stone itself weather differently under the ink? Couldn't this be examined in the right kind of light with the right kind of instruments to replace the missing text - much as is being done to portions of the Dead Seas Scroll and the Archimedes Palimpsest?

I'm skeptical about every archaeological find that comes out of the "Holy Land" these days. Yet, if authentic, I'm not sure how I follow this argument that Christians will have to re-examine their faith. I went to Sunday School and remember all kinds of prophesies about a suffering messiah from the Hebrew Scriptures.

The only mystery here is why some scholars are so mystified. Maybe they need to sit in on some Sunday School classes too.

Messianic message stirs debate

Boston Paul — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 06:27:09 GMT

The idea of a Messiah like that of Jesus is not new.

MITHRAS has the same birthdate as Jesus, but some 600 years earlier. He was also born of a virgin. Mithras, a traveling teacher and master, had 12 disciples as he performed miracles. Just like Jesus, Mithras was buried in a tomb, died, and after three days was resurrected and rose again.

Before Mithras there was Krishna in India.

KRISHNA 1200 BC was born of the Virgin Mother Devaki. Krishna was presented at birth with frankincense, myrrh, and gold. Krishna worked miracles, restored sight, cast out devils, and raised the dead.

Hundreds of years before both Mithras AND Jesus, Krishna was baptized in the River Ganges, crucified between two thieves, died, buried, and resurrected in three days.

HORUS goes back to Egypt circa 3000 BC. Horus was born of the virgin Isis-Meri on December 25 in a cave/manger with his birth being announced by a star in the East and attended by three wise men. In the catacombs at Rome are pictures of the baby Horus being held by the virgin mother Isis. Horus taught in the temple when he was a child. He was baptized when he was 30 years old by “Anup the Baptizer.” HORUS was crucified, buried in a tomb, and then resurrected.

The Greek god ATTIS, born of the Virgin Nana, (or sometimes Cybelem) on December 25 and was reborn and rose from the dead on the third day. Attis was both the Father and the Divine Son. His crucifixion and subsequent resurrection were celebrated annually, with ritual communions of bread and wine.

ADONIS: born on December 25 was son of the virgin Myrha.

HERMES: born on December 25 was the son of the virgin Maia.

DIONYSUS: born on December 25, turned water into wine.

BACCHUS: born on December 25, was crucified in 200 BCE.

PROMETHEUS: born on December 25, descended from heaven as God incarnate as man, to save mankind, and was crucified, suffered, and rose from the dead.

Messianic message stirs debate

Daniel Allison Haslet, Texas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 06:34:22 GMT

This reporter needs to be in another line of work as he is not qualified for this. There is no contoversy to report as there is no error in the word of G-d, either in the Old or New Testaments. The only thing reported in this article is the ignorance of the writer. Jesus and all the desciples were Jews and Jesus was foretold in the Hebrew writings. The only difference is that the Jews are still waiting for Him and we are waiting for Him to come back. I consider myself to be among the chosen people by adoption.

Messianic message stirs debate

L. Lamb, Fredericksburg, Virginia — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 06:41:09 GMT

You know, it amazes me to read about the many people who are so illiterate! Ignorance is truly bliss! Lets let the scholars hash this out people! Debating this early is rubbish! It's like speculating on the value of Gold in 10,000 years, it has no value at all!

Messianic message stirs debate

LP, Portland, OR — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 06:57:25 GMT

Dear Scott Michaels, The bible of today is a collection of 66 books written by several authors. No conspiracy...There were over 500 EYEWITNESSES of Jesus walking, talking, eating, drinking after His bodily resurrection after His death. (which also had many witnesses) Of these witnesses, many of them were not Jews or of "the church". These witnesses, who were ENEMIES of the church and Jesus, wrote about His death and resurrection. Read secular historians TACITUS,JOSEPHUS,SUETONIUS, AND THE ROMAN GOVERNOR PLINY SECUNDUS for instance. The books of the Bible and the eyewitness accounts have been proven to be just as historical as HOMER and ARISTOTLE.

Historical facts; Archaelogical facts; Eyewitness testimonies which can be upheld in a court of law today, all prove Jesus lived, died, and was bodily resurrected.

Only unbelief will keep you from the truth.

Messianic message stirs debate

Karlos Crosby, Seoul, Korea — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 07:11:18 GMT

Why is it surprising??...the early Christians appropriated alot of dates, numerology, festivals, holy places, events etc. in order to popularize their message/ideology and make it more palatable in the process.
The Church did the same thing in Mexico when they toppled the Aztecs.

Messianic message stirs debate

Kent, Indianapolis, Indiana — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 07:22:26 GMT

The more mankind learns about the universe the wider the gap between knowledge and faith becomes. Science deals in the quest for answers. Faith, it seems, deals in the comfortable lack of inquiry. Pre-Christian middle eastern history is more complex and inter-twined than the average pentecostal rapturist cares to understand, because the contradictions are so profound. The question I ask is why religion seems to need these types of items to be "real". It's a validation "faith" shouldn't require. Moreover, faith turning to science to validate itself seems the oddest of bedfellows. Only when they need it, I suppose.

Messianic message stirs debate

E Cameron , England — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 08:09:18 GMT

Assuming this stone and ink thing is genuine have Christian priests explained to their flocks that messiahs were plentiful over long periods of fearfulness and repression among the Jews and that this fact has nothing to do with present problems in today's world. The Biblical message is ethical not supernatural.

Messianic message stirs debate

Al — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 08:17:17 GMT

Enough already! Religion was created by man alone. Where in any of the books, of the three religions that believe in one God, does it say that this religion is the true religion and any other ones are not?...Faith! You either have it or you do not. You either believe or you do not! Regardless of religion, there is only one God who loves his children whether they be black, white, brown, yellow, red, or they be Jew, Muslim, Christian (yes, Catholics are Christians as are all who believe in Jesus Christ), or any other religion that was created by man...

Messianic message stirs debate

Brent Humber, Milton, Fl — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 11:41:14 GMT

Jesus, once said, "everything in the dark will come to the light." This was told to Thomas (Gospels of Thomas). There is a different between what people want and what God gives them, for it is God who best decides what is best for us.

These writing were in the dark, now they have come to the light!

Messianic message stirs debate

Jay, New York, NY — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 11:47:53 GMT

King's James version not King Jesus's version that should say it all right there. What about the religions that predate the two mentioned, why is no attention paid to them?

Messianic message stirs debate

Ron - Salt Lake City, Utah — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 12:05:51 GMT

Unfortunately, the middle east is awash with fake religious items being touted as aincient and sold as expensive antiquities. The problem is the stones are ancient, and with a little inginuity and some elbow grease a good forger can make a really convincing fake.

Messianic message stirs debate

Noah - Los Angeles, CA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 12:16:54 GMT

I can't believe it, it is proof that Gabriel is behind all of these religions, and why some comment are so lame about faith, I got to give credit to whomever wrote this, more to talk about the famous "King of Jews"

Messianic message stirs debate

Roy Wolford, Rochester, IN. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 12:18:33 GMT

So, what about all the Mayan stones in SA?
When God made the Earth and animals and then made man, he realized he goofed up. So God made woman to correct the goof.

Messianic message stirs debate

Scott, Indiana — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 12:25:55 GMT

This is intresting, but will have little impact. One piece of text by itself can have no historical merit by itself. You have to have other texts that date to the same period and say the same thing, etc. to be able to give it historic significance. The books in the Bible have many texts in existance that support it. Not just one stone tablet. This is how all historical documents are validated.

Messianic message stirs debate

Alan Abbey — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 12:29:16 GMT

Thanks for the hat tip to the Shalom Hartman Institute website, where Israel Knohl's original scholarly article can be read in full. Find it yourself at http://hartman.org.il

Messianic message stirs debate

ES, St. Louis, MO — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 12:34:14 GMT

Give me a break. The universe is stranger and more wonderful than we can ever describe. Why resort to myth to explain it away.
The Hebrew/Christian "god" is nothing different than the ancient Roman and Greek "gods", which have all been proven false.
Once humanity gets past the need for a god or gods, we will all be better off.

Messianic message stirs debate

ES, St. Louis, MO — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 12:41:37 GMT

One more thought...
Isn't it amazing that the people who are screaming to "keep an open mind" over this latest rock are the same ones who consider that their beliefs are the one true religion.
Maybe they should practice what they preach and keep an open mind to other beliefs or scientific proofs.

Messianic message stirs debate

TC, Yakima Wa. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:11:01 GMT

ink on paper types or leather, yes. carvings on stone or wood, yes. ink on stone, sounds like a joke or a scam to make money or for a laugh.

Messianic message stirs debate

Dwight h Phoenix, Arizona — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:35:14 GMT

Come on people. How naive are we all? there were no less than 46 savior gods born on Dec 25th and all predate jesus. Mithras was even resurected...1500 years before jesus. Look up Mithras vs Jesus in google. All religion is myth.

Messianic message stirs debate

Andrew James Riemer — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:35:56 GMT

Susan T, the only way to know if the text was written by a true prophet (if the text proves to have come from the period suggested) is if the prophecies have been fulfilled--100% of them. Of course, if any prophecies point to a future time, we will not know until those events come to pass.

I do believe that there were many Hebrew prophecies that were fully realized in the Christ, so, from where I sit, these writings would need to align (not contradict) those things about Christ that have already been documented if they are going to prove true.

Messianic message stirs debate

jim stephens, Tahlequah, OK — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:49:48 GMT

Please,
Organized religion is just a business. Tell morons what they want to hear and they will give you their money. There is no supernatural spirit world. There is no God. The only life after death is if you pass your DNA along to your descendents. Then you MIGHT be reborn with the same consciousness you have now.
Start living for today and don't worry about if the great invisible daddy figure is happy or sad. Spend your money on feeding the hungry.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jack, Illinois — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:53:59 GMT

Regardless of the life of this tablet (real or fake) people will continue to beleive what they want to believe. No evidence is too flimsy for the believer and no evidence is too foolish for the non-believer. This will be pointed too by both sides as confirmation of their individual position. There will never be a resolution. Humanity suffers in this impasse. What are we to do? Regardless of what you HOPE is true, the only people who know for sure are dead, and they're not talking.

Messianic message stirs debate

Anonymous — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:58:23 GMT

It is possible this tablet was written for certain individuals eyes only. Yet why write with ink in stone? Regarding the english translation, as I am shamefully unable to understand the true text given, is merely as I see it a description or an announcement to certain individuals regarding an event. Obviously the person who wrote it knew full well what it meant, and to truly understand such a statement one would require a further understanding of the statements themselves. Are they literal? are they allegorical? Of course if the tablet is verified as genuine, it still wouldn't help anyone in finding the missing words. At this point this is merely a subject for debate. The points are there,but is it possible to put them together?

Messianic message stirs debate

Nathan, West Jordan, Utah — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 14:08:39 GMT

There where pre-Christian prophecies of the coming of a Messiah! Stop the presses! The fact that these prophecies included more detail of Christ's experiences than we have in the Old Testament shouldn't shake Christianity in any way.

Messianic message stirs debate

Kelly, Texas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 14:31:59 GMT

I read the English translation and don't see any reference to a resurrection. I think that people see the words "three days" and want to make that huge leap to someone dying and resurrecting on the third day to fit his/her idea of what the Messiah is supposed to be based on his/her preconceived notions instead of looking at the Jewish teachings to see what the actual Messiah is supposed to be. Read the text carefully to decide for yourself. It's available from BAR and linked above in the article.

Messianic message stirs debate

DinkyDow — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 14:58:17 GMT

"As it is written in the scriptures". The old Testament is the bases for the coming of the messiah. For those who think this is all fiction, while there is no written Roman history of the death and resurrection, there is written history of His followers and they all died a painful and martyred death. I know if I'm supporting a lie and they tell me I will be skewered like a pig over an open fire unless I tell the truth, I'd be inclined to sell out. His followers didn't. They still believed. Even dying horrible, painful deaths in His name. Think about it. Would you die for a lie?

Messianic message stirs debate

Wade Whitlock, Aberdeen, MD — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 14:58:43 GMT

First: Where was it found and who found it?
Second: Can the ink be dated? Can the rock's exposure to the air be dated?
Answer the first two questions without reference to religious myth to receive the truth (no capitals, please!).

Delete the word "faith" from your vocabulary and demand reproducible tests before you accept or deny.

I haven't seen any of the above, so this is merely hearsay and babble. What you usually get when the religiosity take over. Babble and arm-wave with no facts or objective tests.

Amusing, but hardly Cosmic.

Messianic message stirs debate

Dennis McClain-Furmansi, Dalworthington Gardens, Texas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 15:28:34 GMT

The "biblical Jesus" that we're familiar with is an amalgam of many stories from before, during and after his life, first written down centuries after his demise. The virgin birth, moving his birthday from March in order to subvert Saturnalia and the association of Jesus with Nazareth are a few examples. We already know the origin of some of them. The only "news" here is finding a physical sample of such material predating Jesus. For all we know this is just a copy of a major part of the story adopted and adapted to turn the historical Jesus into the biblical figure we know.

I disagree with the statement that there's some sort of "debate" over this. There are different opinions, as should be expected from scientists. If there weren't, THAT would be news. The opinions are based on knowledge of the tablet and its contents. As those become more understood those opinions will converge. There is no on going trading of opinions in order to either come to a consensus or compromise, there is merely opinions contingent on the object's meaning, and the only changes to those will come as solid data becomes available. Thus, there is no "debate".

Messianic message stirs debate

Missionary Carlos Donate — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 15:29:42 GMT

I read the English transcript online but did not really obtain anything new or different than what the Bible reveals regarding the Messiah. In the preserved, and divinely inspired Word of God, we find everything there is to know. No new revelation can be had from recent discoveries, for we have it all now.

Messianic message stirs debate

PB, St. Pete, FL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 16:06:59 GMT

Just a little Biblical history:
Daniel 9:24-26(a) talks about seventy weeks of years, each week representing 7 years each, totalling 490 years. At the end of that time, "Messiah would be cut off." It was also about the rebuilding of the temple in Jerusalem. Point? Daniel fortold when Messiah would be here and when he would die. Isaiah also prophesied when and where, etc. With mathematical precision, the Jews would have known when the prophesied Messiah would come and how, where he would be born, etc. (for reference, there was no zero year). This is one of the ways that the disciples of Jesus identified him as the Messiah. Furthermore, Jesus and his disciples, were of course, all Jews! It was not until after the death of Christ did they become known as Christians, or followers of Christ. At that time, the disciples were all Jews. So a Jewish connection, of course! But the majority of Jews did not accept Jesus as their Messiah as he was not what they were thinking - someone that would shed blood then and there, etc. and be their leader. Jesus was sent to minister to the Jews, as they were at the time, God's chosen people. The invitation to follow Christ was opened to non-Jews after the majority of the Jewish nation had rejected him as the Messiah. That's the short version.

Messianic message stirs debate

Rob S., Chico, CA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 16:24:14 GMT

They made the tablets in order to name a messiah and hype the religion. They wanted to start the religion and needed "Prophecies" to shock people into believing in thier religion. So... they make the prophecy... Jesus is born... they name him the son of god... some guys write a book (A novel if you wish, and man wrote the bible and man lies), people eat it up because it was a "Miracle" and then continue to talk about him and praise him for over 2000 years. Look Im not anti God, I believe in God... Im anti Religion. The whole story of jesus dying for our sins is a nice story, truely inspiring. He did die and it was in the name of cleansing the sins of the people, but no miracle took place. You tell kids to be good and Santa will bring them presents. Well Santa does not exsist... (Saint Nicholas did exsist and he did alot of good things for children, and forever was in the hearts of children and thier parents) but any way Santa does not exist any more, but his spirit lives on... IN OUR HEARTS, to remind us to be giving and good hearted. Jesus was a kind person that was brain washed his whole life that he was a messiah, so to play the part, he was a great guy, helped out everyone and then sacraficed himself to save everyone else... If you tell the masses that this is going down... that thier sins have been forgiven and thier slate is wiped clean... well that is going to let them know that from now on Im going to be a better person... and then you tell everyone that if you do good for the rest of your life you will go to heaven. You accept Jesus in your heart to remind you to be a better person, and if you are good... he will give you a present... eternal life :P

People take it too far for religion... What ever you have faith in doesnt matter... its as long as you have faith. Cause if you think about it... all religions are damn near the same... we all belive in some higher power and a choir of "Angels" or "Gods". The religions are the same... they just have different names, and as humans we cant stand it when others call "OUR" God Budda, or Zues.. or what ever the other gods names are.

Dont believe in a religion, believe in your faith, none of the religions have it right... they are too blind by money and power to even know where to start.

Messianic message stirs debate

Shane, York Pa — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:09:03 GMT

Jewish Messiah, Jewish prophecy, Jewish prophets, Jewish Apostles (yep, all of them), Jewish "churches" not "The Church", Jewish Scriptures. Jewishness is a religion not a race. Hebrew is a race, Israeli is a nationality. According to Paul the Jewish Apostle(Sha'ul) all believing gentiles are Jews based on their faith, just like Abraham. Xtians are Jews, even if they don't know it or want to believe it.

Messianic message stirs debate

Mike H, Texas — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:10:36 GMT

Oh please, give us all a break. What I find that is so unbelievable is that so many people can get so worked up over a fairy tale.

Messianic message stirs debate

Aaron, Boston — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:11:25 GMT

Why does the media interpret a prophecy about ressurrection as being about someone other than Christ? Have you ever read the Old Testament? It is full of prophecies about Christ, look at Isaiah, there are several occasions where he foreshadows Christ. Where do you think he received the revelation to give the prophecy?... Christ. I think it's time to change the headline of the article to "Stone Confirms what Christians already know to be true"- that Jesus Christ and the writings in the New Testament are a further development upon the teachings of Jehovah to the people of the Old Testament.

Messianic message stirs debate

Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:23:51 GMT

Cosmic connection....
only some will be able to see this...
Behold the throne...
http://imgsrc.hubblesite.org/hu/db/1996/22/images/a/formats/print.jpg
Image is located inside white box area..

Messianic message stirs debate

Johnny Awake, Chicago, IL — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:27:08 GMT

The Bible is a bunch of symbolism created by The Knights Templar secret society, in order to pass ancient secret knowledge on to their heirs who were taught how to decode the messages, while the masses became brainwashed & controlled by taking it literally. Anyone who does any research should find it very strange at the sheer number of secret societies that have existed since ancient times & still allowed to exist today (i.e. Freemasons, The Round Table, The Order of the Golden Dawn, The Skull & Bones Society, The Priori of Sion, etc.). What are they hiding? I believe them to be hiding the true story of history so they may more easily control the masses, while they profit & engage in Satanic rituals. People, you desperately need to wake up & stop believing these lies. I recommend a book written by David Icke called 'The Biggest Secret' that provides vast evidence of everything I have stated & more. I encourage everyone to search for the truth themselves & stop believing the corrupt government & media - they were created by pure evil & cannot be trusted. We must all rise up against this evil force responsible for creating every war & funding both sides in order to decide the outcome for themselves.

Messianic message stirs debate

JCE, Twin Cities, MN — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:33:55 GMT

Sorry, I just need to vent... ..... perhaps a bit off topic. perhaps not..... I say - rant it all and let the editors sort it out!

or cut it all together. oh well.

I don't mean to attack anyone here. I am just confused and frustrated by the view of the average person and how it effects their view of things.

so here goes...

Hey! If writing something down makes it true... then maybe this tablet is talking about the past. And maybe it's actually talking about Mithra. He died and came back to life three days later!:)

"This shouldn't be a surprise! We have been talking about Jesus for over 2,000 years ... How much proof does mankind want?" how about something solid? how about if god or jesus or angels make themselves known so people can sepporate the fact from just being chemically unbalanced or being lied to constantly?

"We have the time" vaguely. And so what?
On the fringe there is still a lot of debate over the exact times and the exact places due to translation problems, numbers can be wrong or translated wrong, words change and are retranslated useing modern ideas of the words.
Plus you can't totally rule out a lot of the whacko stuff like did the name "Nazareth" exist at the time? Some claim it did not, some claim it is "Jesus THE nazereen" a sect of the essenes (sp).
The people who claim Mary and Jesus were married and that Mary took their children to europe (or possible as far as canada) have just as much if not more times and places and names and events than the bible does and yet they are ridiculed.

Just pointing out that unless you look at many of the views, then it's only blind faith that will lead you down any blind alley, you wind up with a narrow and often untrue view of the reality of things when you strictly believe in the only thing you've been told to know. ...

We have the time and place to most of fictional writings. 'Moby Dick' must be true because we have the time, the place, even the event. People never write a fictionalized version of a real time, place, or event. Spider-man must be true because New York exists! Daredevil was real because I've been to Hell's Kitchen! ...

This tablet isn't going to change anything, because once again "GOD" can't just come out and let us all know the truth so we can have a chance to follow or not follow. Instead it's a rock with INK on it.
and a ton of things that suggest it's fake, but one or two things that make it seem like it could be real.

Gosh! Now THERE is a god who is decisive!!! ...

[ALAN ADDS: I've edited down this rant pretty severely after JCE's invitation. I can let comments run pretty long, but if they're too long (like JCE's previous posting), I just have to let it go. My apologies, again, to all those whose messages I have not approved, usually because they go after a specific person's views a little too aggressively or because they're too much off-topic.]

Messianic message stirs debate

DW — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:43:25 GMT

it's really amazing how so many people keep buying the old (debunked) theory of a gnostic-redeemer myth predating christianity! the idea of the dying and rising god in earlier (and later) mythologies may have some parallels, but if you closely examine them compared to the gospel texts it is obvious they are not related. as to the validity of this tablet? who knows? i'll be interested in how it turns out. and please give up on this big, bad church conspiracy stuff! some secrets are too big to keep. if this were something that incredible, it would have been published a long time ago. contra dan brown the christian church is not a big, political monolith controlled by rome!

Messianic message stirs debate

G. Phoenix, AZ — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:50:49 GMT

Ardent followers of benevolent faiths are generally really, really good people. That is the benefit and unfortunate necessity of religion.
It's just such a shame that they aren't capable of finding that same morality and compassion for others that don't subscribe to their same faith.
All of your books written of fantasy and myth and collected from multiple, polytheistic faiths from throughout the ages are mostly tales of fiction.
That doesn't make them bad books, but it certainly does mean that you shouldn't be taking hardly anything written in them as fact.
Read the good, understand it, practice it and move on.
Leave the nonsense behind and stop rejecting fact that contradicts your faith.

So here's a sample of evidence that seems to indicate that some essential parts of Christianity are based on nothing more than a collection of writtings from previously practiced faiths.
Welcome to the whole Bible.

Messianic message stirs debate

Ed Bellue, Fairhope, Alabama — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:58:18 GMT

It is not surprising when so many people have tried to disprove the Bible and no one has. Jesus filled so many prophecies in the old testement perfectly (that not one person has ever disproved, many have tried) that statistically he is overwhelmingly the Messiah. This is no newsflash

Messianic message stirs debate

here — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 18:01:27 GMT

The problem with christianity is that it asks its sheep to pay attention to certain parts of the bible and ignore the rest. In the OT, god has his followers murder/pillage/rape anyone that he wants and in the NT, he is suddenly all cute and loving. What about all the "laws" in the OT. Stoning people for minor offenses like sleeping in the same room as a menstrating woman or eating shellfish. The faithful ignore those statements and focus on the more "acceptable" messages: gays are bad and the other garbage. So, if the NT makes so many references to the OT, but the OT is so chalked full of garbage that it loses credibility, then that means that the NT loses its credibility as well. Faith doesn't mean that you have to be stupid. If god really exists, I bet that he wants us to be happy and live are lives how we want. Don't hate people because of their preferences, support stem cell research, and think for yourselfs about a really old book written by unconfirmable sources. If god doesn't want us to be happy and live a happy life, then he's not a god that I want any part of.

Messianic message stirs debate

Michael Part — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 18:03:14 GMT

More proof it's tough to tell a story that makes sense from ancient fragments, but evidently not tough enough to believe in absolutely, fight wars over, and kill each other in its name.

Messianic message stirs debate

Mark Thieme — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 18:10:50 GMT

Certainly, one may have multiple concerns in life, with one or another taking precedent in various circumstances.

If "religion" is that in which one, in daily life, exhibits "ultimate concern" then we may be said to be a multi-religious nation.

It has been said that the United States, for instance, is a "Christian nation." In daily practice of ultimate concern, however, the United States may be more accurately described as a "Capital/Material" nation with the profit motive as our rule of faith.

Since "profit" does not actually exist as a created being or object, one more precisely understands profit as a way of economic skimming, squeezing, or even a form of "temporary reallocation." Profit is therefore the detritus of economy which is then reinvested and recirculated. Detritus, having a pejorative implication, is merely a reflection of another term in common usage, "filthy lucre."

Thus stated, Americans in particular are deluded by forms of religion which have little to do with the state religion. What does Christianity (or an other so-called religion, even the great Science) have to do with the worship of something touched by many and controlled by few?

The great irony is observing clerics (priests, imams, pastors) driving expensive cars, wearing expensive clothes, living a life of material consumption, while the poor are being fed in soup kitchens at the church, synagogue or mosque. In one snapshot we discern what is of "ultimate concern."

In short, all of this Sturm und Drang about tablets, shrouds, tombs, infallible scriptures, palimpsests, supposedly casting light on some ultimate reality when all around us is the direct evidence of our own reality which will no doubt prove "ultimate" for us, despite the heavy veils of delusion we so willingly wear to work and play every day.

Messianic message stirs debate

Mike, Victoria, B.C. — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 18:15:41 GMT

Christians really need to stop falling on belief which has an open doorway into superstition, and start practising objectivity and research the orgins of Christianity from an academic point of action. If this was done this story as seen from a collective whole would have had a lot of the missing gaps filled. Case in point, most of the Jesus story is found in many mystery religions ( Mithraism is but one example ) predatidating Christianity, some by thousands of years.

Messianic message stirs debate

Stacy, Michigan — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 18:17:16 GMT

I wonder if future civilizations will be just as astounded by discovering ancient Flying Spaghetti Monster relics as this one is about tablets with indiscernible messages.

Messianic message stirs debate

Bob Griffin, North Hollywood, CA — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 18:18:35 GMT

It is interesting to watch the dialog. Most of the Christians believe it supports Christianity. Most of the Non-Christians believe it disproves Christianity.

Assuming it is an historical artifact dating from the end of the 1st century BCE, and thus refering to someone other than Jesus, it would certainly explain why the early followers of Jesus both claimed that he had predicted his resurrection and that it took them by surprise.

To me this suggests that Christianity (whether true or false) is deeply rooted in 2nd Temple Judaism.

Be Well,
Bob Griffin

Messianic message stirs debate

Don Strawsburg, Maryland — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 18:19:30 GMT

Why wouldn't the headline be, "More evidence discovered that provides more proof that Jesus is the Messiah." No matter what is discovered it is used against the Christian faith.

Oh, I know, that is what my Bible said would happen, that Christians would be hated, and suffer like Christ.

And it says,

Matthew 11:15
"He who has ears to hear, let him hear!"

But none will ever hear, except through the grace of God. So for us that have been called and hear, we should pray for those that have not.

In Christ!

Messianic message stirs debate

Jeremy, Va — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 18:27:48 GMT

There are many messianic stories that predate Christianity and even Judaism. Look to Sumeria to find the truth. All paths lead back to the beginning of civilization.

Messianic message stirs debate

JCE, TwinCities,MN — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 18:32:04 GMT

Here are a couple of good sites to check out on the interpretations of the tablet.

1)http://www.bib-arch.org/news/dss-in-stone-news.asp

Which will lead you to a pdf of the text on the stone.
Here is the english trans -

http://www.bib-arch.org/news/dssinstone_english.pdf

and in Hebrew -
http://www.bib-arch.org/images/DSS-stone-hebrew.jpg

Here is a good article of an indepth look at the text.

2) http://www.hartman.org.il/SHInews_View_Eng.asp?Article_Id=124

Which will lead you to a pdf of

“By Three Days, Live”: Messiahs,
Resurrection, and Ascent to Heaven in
Hazon Gabriel*
Israel Knohl / Hebrew University of Jerusalem

ftp://80.179.136.36/site/Israel_Knohl_on_Hazon_Gabriel.pdf

It (the stone) really doesn't seem to suggest anything about Jesus but rather seems to be refering to Joseph and Ephriam.

It doesn't seem to really be predicting anything into a far future.

Very interesting reads.

Messianic message stirs debate

A True Jew, Ontario, Canada — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 19:06:35 GMT

I started reading this and thought 'Oh wow, what is this crap?' First of all, they're acting like the Bible wasn't written by the Jews; second, they're implying that the 100+ prophecies about Messiah in the Old Testament dont exist; thirdly, they're going so far as to imply that the gospels (and by extention) the rest of the Bible) are false. Over 2,000 people saw Christ afer his death. Denying history makes you look like a fool.

Messianic message stirs debate

Mark Thieme — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 19:24:24 GMT

"Physical concepts are free creations of the human mind, and are not, however it may seem, uniquely determined by the external world." -Einstein

Thus the High Priest of contemporary science places science on the same plane as religion: "Free creations of the human mind."

Messianic message stirs debate

Bob, North Las Vegas, Nevada — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 19:54:10 GMT

Are you kidding? These questions and debates will never end. Religion is a big business...

Messianic message stirs debate

Mary Ling — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:21:19 GMT

Interesting! What it is - is that nobody really knows because not enough Scrolls have been discovered yet, but in time it will happen. There is much still to be unearthed...and all the fight and persecutions in the last 2000 years will hopefully not be repeated. Indeed disappear.

Messianic message stirs debate

Mark, Phoenix AZ — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:24:27 GMT

One should not be so concerned with the past and ask why in over 2000 years have there been no more prophets, no more miracle, no more religious figures. Why did all of this stuff occur so long ago? Why did they all seem to go away so long ago?

Religion is just another POLITICAL means to control humans. The creator gave us FREE WILL and then religious leaders took it all away. All of the religions in the world preach love and create nothing but hate, war, guilt and strife amongst themselves. Catholic priests abusing children, Fundamentalist Muslims killing the non believers. THINK FOR A MINUTE if there were no religions, how many souls would have not died in the past 2000 years in the name of Christ or Allah?

Messianic message stirs debate

r. james Kenosh, WI — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:52:20 GMT

The fact that people even discuss religion as if it is anything but myth is shameful and disheartening. Religion was a good way to explain the unexplainable when people still thought the earth was flat and diseases were caused by evil spirits but all it is good for now is delaying our progress as a species. One person stated earlier that there are none so blind as those who refuse to see so when will people open their eyes and stop following these false prophets and superstitions?

Messianic message stirs debate

Doug Gibson, Regina, Saskatchewan — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:59:04 GMT

When I first became a Christian about 25 years ago, I sometimes wondered if the New Testament writers simply chose Old Testament passages and interpreted them as being messianic prophecies so they could say Jesus fulfilled them. Since then I have found that their interpretations were already held by rabbis. The targum paraphrases, the Talmud, and other extra-canonical Jewish texts in the second temple period clearly dispel the modern myth that the Jews only sought a deliverer to defeat the Romans. There is a compendium of many of the prophecies in the book The Messiah Texts, by Jewish author Raphael Patai. As a Christian I find it in my best interest to find out what Jews in the second temple period believed about the expected messiah. The tablet neither adds to or detracts from what we already know from ancient Jewish sources. Some scholar will probably argue that the tablet was made after Jesus by some early Christians. Just wait. I know those academics.

Messianic message stirs debate

N Eastwood, SoCal — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 21:17:53 GMT

Anything that could be said about this has been said already. Just a note for Frank in Philly: Catholics AND Christians? Catholics are Christians, my dear.

Messianic message stirs debate

Charles Stout Fruitland Utah — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 00:37:25 GMT

interesting, yet more than likely meaningless, how about the claimed 40'spacecraft found locked in 150 million year old strata? probally more disinformation.......mmmm

Messianic message stirs debate

Matt H. in Delaware — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 00:44:30 GMT

"You have in Christian theology a very different kind of messiah, a messiah who's going to shed blood and atone for your sins," Shanks observed. "Where the hell did this come from, baby? Are there elements of this in Jewish messianism?"-excellent, controversial pun! Funny how Americans forget that words normally have more than one meaning...

Messianic message stirs debate

fairigodmuther — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 01:19:50 GMT

All religon stems from other religons, and all the teaching and stories from those religons, were told by campfires, from elders to get people to have some set of morales and laws. ALL religons are based on stories, to exlpain who we think we are and how we should be. All the religons talk about peace, but then fight amogest themselves as to who is right and who is wrong. You are all right and wrong. Its a guideline people, a road map. God himself didn't write the bibles, a bunch of people who wanted order came up with the stories, why wouldn't be the same??

Messianic message stirs debate

Joe — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 01:31:33 GMT

Basically, they are saying (with little backbone), that the story of Jesus was invented before Jesus was born.

Sadly, rationality will continue to be scarce in religious circles. Facts and scientific inquiry have little influence on believers. They seem to think that God only gave people rationality to trick them. It's safer to believe what we are told than actually be responsible for the consequences of our actions.

Messianic message stirs debate

travis, illinois — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 03:38:34 GMT

until a new religion replaces christianity, no hardcore evidence will sway those who are unable to live without a religion

Messianic message stirs debate

William Chandler greenville South Carolina — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 04:13:23 GMT

Another ploy from Satan no doubt, to try to disrupt the church of Jesus Christ. But Hey' the true christians of this world know that we have all we need right there in the word of God. And if people would except him, and walk HOLY befor him,HIS WAY
nothing lacking, he would reveal himself to them and show them all we need is God's word.
Try-Praying and fasting and living in the word of God.
these three steps will bring him close to you.
I promise you will not be disapointed.

Messianic message stirs debate

PaulRevere — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 04:28:52 GMT

This is just another neocon plot to brainwash everyone that, deep down we're all really jewish... thus supporting israel and all the insanity that goes with it without question i.e. Iran, etc...

us versus them, remember?

well, why are we shedding American blood for zionist interests?

unless you convince the herd.. flock, whatever... that we are them and them us.

it's a false flag religious umbilical cord... created out of whole cloth...

let's get the ink carbon dated...

but no... poof...

down the memory hole... let's come back in 6 months are weigh the progress of the investigation into the dating of the ink...

It will be as if the story never even existed...

but the psychological impact will remain...

Messianic message stirs debate

Steve, Dayton Ohio — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 05:35:03 GMT

Will someone explain something to me, please?? If He died at approximately 3PM Friday... and arose at dawn on Sunday... Where do you get three days from??
Best case: Friday to Saturday then Saturday to Sunday is TWO days... Worst case it's a day and a half or 38 hours.

Messianic message stirs debate

Animus01, NOLA — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 05:44:16 GMT

At this point, I say the smartest move here is to just walk away. Mark 6:11 says, "And if any place will not welcome you or listen to you, shake the dust off your feet when you leave, as a testimony against them." Of course, this is not someone's home, and we cannot shake any dust onto the webpage, I say the best thing to do is declare Mark 6:11 on this article and just leave. The internet trolls here love our stay and hate our very existence. So, rather than feed the trolls, let's no longer bother replying to them. We know The Truth. We shouldn't waste our time trying to deal with the blind who claim they can see.

*wipes the dust off his feet and leaves.*

This article is officially Mark 6:11'd.

Messianic message stirs debate

GuessWho, Needles, CA — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 13:41:31 GMT

Blind Faith In A Supreme Being: A psychological disorder afflicting approximately 90% of mankind. There is no known cure. The main symptom being the inability to see actual reality, rather than create a 'perceived reality' conforming to the sufferer's pysychological and emotional needs. It is recommended that sane individuals not try to shake the belief structure of the afflicted, as this would be the functional equivalent of trying to teach a pig to sing.

Messianic message stirs debate

JWB, Punta Gorda, FL — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 14:36:58 GMT

Check out the ink to determine its composition and age. Then, we will have a meaningful discussion.

Messianic message stirs debate

Deb, Connersville IN — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 14:58:57 GMT

I really liked the comment that reminded us the scriptures say "even the rocks will cry out". Is that what is taking place? Have we stopped declaring He is Lord enough that the "rocks" are fulfilling scripture? I don't want the "rocks" to say it for me....I believe and have faith in the Bible. I stand by its truths and teachings, Old and New Testament. One fulfills the other. Jesus died for our sins and paid the debt for our transgressions. All we have to do is believe, be born again as the word says, and be a witness or light to the world.

Messianic message stirs debate

ted vail, atlanta, GA — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 15:52:09 GMT

humans are not capable of change. those who believe will believe, those who don't won't. this stone, even if it were a burning bush, will convince no one to change their current views.

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Adam, St. Louis — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 16:06:40 GMT

lol some of you are amazingly dense! Using the words "proof" and "bible" in even the same sentence is idiotic. I refuse to put blind faith into ANYTHING until I see PROOF!!! and if I am going to hell, damn the bad luck! lol!

I wonder if I write something on stone and bury it and people find it a few thousand years from now, will that make it automatically correct? [...]

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Jeff B., Granada Hills, Ca. — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 16:06:59 GMT

1. First, while there are numerous references to Messiah" in old Jewish texts, not ONE of them mentions crucifiction. 2. Suffering Messiah, written long before Jesus, was ripe for Jesus' followers to simply put a NAME (Jesus) on the prophesies. 3. Jesus could NOT be the Messiah, because the prophesies as to what happens WHEN Messiah COMES have not been realized. 4. I agree - B.S. that ink would have been written on stone. 5. NO provenance. UGH.

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ES, St. Louis, MO — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 16:37:17 GMT

As far as the "my religion is right" crowd, when Jesus walks into your church, let me know.

In studying science, I have seen NOTHING to indicate a "creator" or anything resembling the so called "intelligent design" myths.

In my long ago church going days, I had a pastor who told me that a fossil in my collection "could not exist because the Bible doesn't mention anything about life that pre-existed man." Therefore, according to him it "couldn't be real" unless "God" made that rock to "appear to be that old." Is it just me, or is that a REAL stretch of imagination that "God" could be so malevolent, especially when he is porrtrayed as being so benevolent and loving?

Also, what about the quote of St. Augustine that "freedom to question is nothing more than freedom to be wrong." Not to mention the burning at the stake of Giordano Bruno, the murder of Hypatia, who was the last librarian at the great library in Alexandria, the censure and house arrest of Galileo, and the murder and persecution of scientists throughout history who "dared" to question the absolute authority and wisdom of the "holy church."

Face it...to those of us with "open minds" such statements by supposed holy men seem to offer tangible evidence that religion is a myth that is always twisted to fit a certain perspective. It has absolutely nothing to do with fact.

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Hiram K. Myers — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 18:51:04 GMT

Keep in mind that when Constantine became a Christian, he imposed his mythical religion upon all of Rome. Any written matter that contradicted the official dogma adopted at the Council of Nicea was ordered burned. Thus began the greatest distruction of literature in the history of mankind. The fires blazed for months in every city and village across the empire, and ushered in 1000 years of ignorance known today as the Dark Ages. Jesus was a scholar, a rabi, and was undoubtedly fluent in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek, languages of the Levant. Thre can be no doubt that he could write. It is ludicrous to think that one so educated and convinced of his own message would not record it in his own hand. Was his personal gospel sacrificed to the flames or was it discovered and hidden in the bowels of the catacombs? Perhaps a copy survived and contains a denial of his messianic role. Perhaps he announced that he was not the son of God and had no desire to be so depicted. Two books, Malachi's Child and Murder is a Consideration deal with this subject.

Christianity will someday be exposed as the most preposterous fraud ever perpetrated on the human race.

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Troy, Elsmere, Kentucky — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 19:01:37 GMT

It's all just a bunch of crap. We live in a chemico-physical universe that hasn't the capacity to care or even know about little old us. Why are you all so afraid? We are born, we enjoy life, hate it or are unmoved, then we die. We discorporate. We are non-contiguous. There is not and has never been a "spritual" aspect to existence. I live in a world where 90% of the population lives their lives according to wishful thinking. Sad.

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Mark Thieme — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 19:01:59 GMT

William Faulkner said, "The past is not really dead, in fact, it is not really past."

Why not...

...try to treat whomever we meet with respect, whether they deserve it or not?

Why not try our best to live an honest life, work hard and take one day a week for sabbath?

Be thankful. Give patience a whirl. Worship freely. Pray at all times.

Help somebody everyday, without anyone knowing.

Practice kindness.

Sow seeds of peace we will never see sprout in our lifetime.

Love our family, even when they are unlovable. Trust grace, practice mercy. Make fairness our standard of business. When someone mistreats us, sulk if we must, but get over it.

Enjoy the days of our life.

Take a day off, find a flat stone, write all of this down, with a few of our own inspirations.

Bury it and take a nap.

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D-Man, Dallas — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 19:57:31 GMT

Pseudointellectuals, you're walking into darkness.

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William Winkelman, Tucson, Arizona — Thu, 10 Jul 2008 01:06:46 GMT

Even if this stone is genuine and predates Jesus, it does not prove that the Jesus Christ of the New Testament ever existed. There is no corroborative evidence of Jesus' life coming from the Romans living at the time of the purported life of Jesus. No mention appears in any Roman writings of the star of Bethlehem (which had to hover over the birthplace of Jesus instead of moving along with the rest of the stars), Herod's murder of young Jewish males (which the Romans would have considered a stupid thing to do and wouldn't have allowed), or the simultaneous earthquake -- in which the deceased emerged from their graves and walked around among the non-deceased -- and solar eclipse at Jesus' death. The Romans, who were always looking for something to write about, would have certainly mentioned any of these events if these events had really happened. The conclusion has to be that these events did not happen and that there was never such a person as Jesus Christ as described in the New Testament.
The stone, whether genuinely from the time of the first century or written later on, only shows the origin of the Jesus Christ legend and nothing more. It is of interest only for that.

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Kevin Breen — Thu, 10 Jul 2008 02:19:21 GMT

What do we have? Let's see... "Jewish messaiah" plus "rises after three days." I wonder how much of the prophecy that DOESN'T fit the Christ myth are being ignored? The savior who dies and is reborn, usually involving a tree symbol of some sort like the cross, is a common theme in Norse, Egyptian, Greek, Roman and even, symbolically, in the story of Buddha. All it proves is that the theme is universal in the human consciousness and is repeated in most faiths, each of which unfortunately maintains that their version is the only truth.

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Mark Thieme — Thu, 10 Jul 2008 05:24:02 GMT

Christians are a literally obsessed lot.

Few religions understand their scriptures to be "facts" of recorded history.

The terms "allegory," "metaphor," and "archetype" are weasel words to many "practicing" Christians.

Radical Christians and radical Islamics have this in common. Ironically, these two "religions" have not only discredited their rich traditions, they have presented borderline psychosis as a "spiritual" lifestyle.

When read with appropriate respect to the writers, historical readers, and subsequent literary editors, the Koran and the Christian Bible are quite powerful statements of faith. Understood in their authentic context these scriptures take us far beyond the air-tight bubbles which humans are prone to invent in order to deny the greater reality of the common stream.

We live in barbarous times, led by retrograde literalists who would sooner shoot a doctor in the name of Christ, blow up a building in the name of Allah, destroy libraries and universities in the name of "Truth," or preemptively invade a nation in the name of "Freedom," than to pause for one blessed moment in appeal to the "better angels" of their dubious theologies.

As the brilliant Japanese philosopher, Nishida Kitaro, suggested, himself surrounded by mental, spiritual, and political midgets in the Japan of the early 20th century,

"...there is no reason to feel wonder at breaking beyond one's own small consciousness and realizing one great spirit. Perhaps it is our attachment to the sphere of our small consciousness that is most in error."

Put more succinctly by the colorful old miner Percy Garris when it became evident that Butch and Sundance, his payroll guards, were more scared than smart,

"Morons! I've got morons on my team."

Yesirreebob.

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ES, St. Louis, MO — Thu, 10 Jul 2008 13:53:57 GMT

That's OK by me, D-Man...

Some of my best times have been in the dark!

Just kidding...I do appreciate your concern but, I guess, this is a point we'll just have to agree to disagree on.

But I'd still love to debate this over a cup of coffee!

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G. Jones, Indianapolis, IN — Fri, 18 Jul 2008 17:50:39 GMT

THIS IS A HOAX!!!!!

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Saul Wall, Saint John, Canada — Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:44:11 GMT

I like how the NYT told their readers what "some" Christians would probably think about this rather than actually ask them. Effectively we are told that those nasty old Christians will hate this so it must make Christianity look foolish. I am as anti-religious as most anyone but I don't hate Christians (or Jews) the way media folk seem to do which is why I do not assume them to be stupid or petty. Unfortunately, I can not give the same benefit of the doubt to NYT and other media due to experience.

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Wakefield Tolbert, Atlanta — Thu, 24 Jul 2008 00:51:11 GMT

Rick said in part:

"Hopefully more objective scholars will help the worlds peoples understand the mythical nature of their core beliefs, and render religious excuses for war moot. In the meantime, who do I vote for for president when both candidates profess a strong belief in religious lies? "

HUH?

So now we have from some the mixing of artifacts with modern politics?! WHAT!? It is astonishing some people in their zeal to show their hatred for faith would stoop to this kind of nuttiness. I don't recall McCain, Obama, Bush, or anyone else in modern politics using religion to justify or not justify some foreign policy action. There IS a "just war" statement by the Church that justifies certain instances of having to go to war--and secular society generally recognizes these also. Else we'd all be speaking German or Japanese.

The Bible does make mention in Romans and Corinthians from letters of Paul that we are to obey secular government---but to claim that the Bible advocates war per se? HUH??

Whatever our differences over the policies or prospective policies set forth by the candidates recently, this idea that they are alluding to Scriptural references for some purpose in foreign affairs is absurd to say the least

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winstrol depot, sustanon, NV — Fri, 25 Jul 2008 08:21:12 GMT

The Old Testament, Hebrew writings penned by Hebrew leaders and prophets, is full of references to a suffering messiah. Check out Isaiah 53 for proof of this.

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Karin, Phoenix, AZ — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 16:50:33 GMT

Newsflash, Jesus was a Jew and so were the disciples. There are A LOT of Jews who believe that Jesus is/was the Messiah and as a Jew, you have unique understanding of connecting/understanding both the old and new testament.

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Batron, Tacoma, WA — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 17:09:09 GMT

Faith is hope in things unseen. Faith is believing even when others call what you believe a fairy tale or a lie. If you wait for proof to create a foundation of trust in what was unseen you will never be fulfilled.

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Tammy, Estero, Florida — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 17:26:04 GMT

None of the recent discoveries should be a suprise. Afterall, Father God sent Jesus to earth as a Jewish man. Of course Judaisim and Christianity are linked.

Futhermore, since we are living in the time when Jesus could return, there will be more and more discoveries that will either increase belief and faith in Jesus or will increase skepticisim. I am excited to see all the discoveries, to me these further prove what I already believe.

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Michael H — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 17:32:47 GMT

Why will this shake the belief of Christians around the world, that is that "Jewish scriptures prefigured Christian theology?" Isn't that called the Old Testament? :)

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ya'akov — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 18:33:21 GMT

What difference does it make? People will contiune to

believe or not as is their wont.

I'm suspicious because of the ink. But, I'm no scholar.

NU????

People are human and sometimes not even that

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Mike, NC — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 18:47:12 GMT

Jeez, those who are believers won't be changed because the brilliant and unfortunately lasting thing about religion is that common sense and facts are not involved. A belief is nothing more than an unproved story one has decided to accept as "fact" and no real data will sway that. The best part is that this rediculousness is described as devout!

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Jordan Knight, Atlanta, GA — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 19:18:16 GMT

All this proves is that some Christians will always look for things to prove what they believe in, and some non-Christians will always look for things to prove what they don't believe in. The bottom line is that none of us can really know if Jesus was resurrected or not because NONE OF US WERE THERE! And if God would condemn people to hell based on something that happened 2,000 yrs. ago and we have no material in-front-of-our-eyes proof that it happened, then he sucks. I choose not to believe this because I can't go through my life with that kind of sucky attitude. If Jesus did resurrect, cool, but if he didn't I don't think we are all doomed. I think God's a little better than that.

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David Seal — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 19:33:13 GMT

Keep in mind that the New Testament indicates Jesus was not the only one resurrected on that day. It states that day many walked the earth that had previously been dead. Do any of these prophecies indicate this? The others are not often mentioned, and many times I have heard the dogma that Jesus was the only one to ever be resurrected.

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Donald Reid, Westminster, SC — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 20:02:48 GMT

Shocking? I don't think so. Even down here in the Bible Belt, it is plain. Judaism first. Christianity and Islam are her daughters.

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travis,portland,oregon — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 20:34:39 GMT

May this add to the ongoing Reconciliation between the Jews and the Christians.We will be one people, God willing.

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Ann Dougherty, Longton, Kansas — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 20:55:06 GMT

The only thing that is new about this is that, apparently, somebody prophesied, before Christ, that the Messiah would be raised in three days. However, this may be a repetition of what the writer had already heard Jesus say, if it was written during the later part of the possible time period.

The Messiah could not be just anybody. He had to be the inheritor of the throne line of David. In other words, if there had been a Davidic king on the throne of Israel rather than a Roman occupation, then he would have been that king. The genealogies in Matthew and Luke make it quite clear that Joseph would have been king and, as he accepted Jesus as his legitimate firstborn son, that Jesus would have been the Davidic king after Joseph.

The prophecy of Daniel gives a clear time line from his day to when "Messiah, the Prince" would be "cut off", i.e. killed. This time line, I have been told, though I have not done the workings myself, finishes exactly on Good Friday of the year 33 A.D., which could very probably have been the date of Jesu's crucifixion.

Joseph, being the heir to the Davidic throne, knew, therefore, that the prophesied Messiah would be either his son or grandson. Also there was undoubtedly heightened expectation among the general population. The Jews knew when to expect their Messiah.

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Cleveland, Tn — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 21:41:07 GMT

Could the three prophets be Jesu, Muhammad, and maybe Budda?

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dolfina, austin, texas — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 21:58:00 GMT

The historical Jesus is a fact. Go from there, and understand what the Bible calls, The Great Mystery. Adam and Eve were told in the garden that they could become like God, and know good from evil, now that is the "new age" dogma, "we are all gods"...well, we aren't. There are none so blind as those that refuse to see. Even Paul said, "O Lord, help my unbelief".

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Catherine F., Miami, FL — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 22:15:30 GMT

Oh please. Why do they keep coming up with these random tablets and things to try to disprove Jesus' messiah-ship(if thats said right but you know what I mean). All the proof you need is the change in the life of those who believe. Before I was a non-believer I was a depressed, suicidal girl. I put my faith in Christ and Im changed. How much more proof do you need?

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Cheryl McClure, Del City, okla. — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 22:58:17 GMT

Im afraid my feelings are like Ahmed Zahmed. This poor stone has been picked apart. There where 4 other Messiah. All did different things. But in the end, One was killed, another was ignored, another shown the door, the last was treated like a he was dumb. Then came Our, "Lord and Savior". Lest we foreget, we are all his people. And how we act, talk, dress, and handle are selfs, is how we are precevied. Jesus died on the cross for our sins. He died for us, all, everyone.This stone maybe a connection, but I'll take my faith with the Lord and the Bible. Still archaeologist are finding biblical citys they say never existed. And today are being proven wrong.

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Deborah Hill — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 23:13:36 GMT

Whoa! I just lost 10 IQ points!!!

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Cora, Ontario, Canada — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 23:29:48 GMT

*Ink on Stone, not a traditional medium for the age-

Peace and Understanding,
Cora

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Pic — Sun, 05 Oct 2008 19:43:20 GMT

One thing that is universal is the Art of The Prophecy and the foretelling or causation of spectacular events due to inherent beliefs and changing ideals, shaping our future and our history. The most spell bounding is the latent ability to read the future. No matter how you slice it, something was going on.

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remeber the future — Tue, 07 Oct 2008 18:58:55 GMT

Jewish and Christian 'belief' is new. Look further back in time, the truth is not about some group giving themselves a name. Some people know the game, others just have faith in something they know not.

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Online Church — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 01:14:24 GMT

This discovery will not bring the Jews and the Christians closer together. Christians will always be idolaters in the eyes of the Jews as long as they worship Jesus the God-Man.

If the find is true however, and the Jews recognize this find as being a valuable piece of historical evidence that points to Yehoshua (Jesus) being the Jewish Messiah, the Jews may find that they have more in common with their 'natural' brothers, the Muslims.

It is a travesty that such incredible historic finds as this (if proven to be true) have to be approved not only historically, but also politically.

In the end... This find will probably not make much difference at all.

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thecryingprophet, Oklahoma City, OK — Fri, 24 Oct 2008 19:13:06 GMT

the "Vision of Gabriel" is not a yawner for New Testament scholars: "It's important, if authentic, because it provides more evidence - if we needed it - that Jews believed in bodily resurrection. ... There is a school of interpretation out there, represented by the 'Zeitgeist' movie, saying that these ideas of resurrection came from Egypt. What this would show is that, no, this is something that was in Jewish literature. We have absolutely no need to posit a pagan origin for these kinds of ideas."

Unfortunately, a LARGE part of Hebrew tradition can be directly linked to Egyptian "paganism" since the Hebrews were enslaved by the Egyptians, just as large segment of Hebrew "law" can be traced to mesopotamia (i.e. the Code of Hammurabi) as the Hebrews were slaves there, too...there is more than a small possibility that the notion of resurrection IS directly linked to Egyptian "paganism"

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Shabbat215 — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 23:57:28 GMT

It's sad that the true Yeshua of the scriptures has been so diluted and distorted by the Greek influences of Gentile church fathers that we hidden the true Meshiac from the Jews. Yeshua (Jesus) has been recreated to fit the anti-Torah hermenutics of a Gentile sect of beleivers that were antisemetic. Not all gentile beleivers were this way, but were forced to turn this group after having been kicked out of the synagogues for not following the Barcokba revolt around 65-70 AD. So you had a group of believers both Jew and Gentile, both Torah observant, both practicing Judaism, that were not able to return to the synagague and refused to embrace the Roman version of Judaism we now call Christianity. Take an honest look at the writings of the Church fathers. Ignacious was among the first to tell the believers not to keep the Sabbath in the Jewish manner. I don't really blame people so much as I do thier teachers who know this and keep it from them. It's time people really start asking questions about what they believe, the Barians did and Paul commended them.

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Gary Young — Wed, 19 Nov 2008 01:31:08 GMT

If the God of the Holy Bible (both Old and New Testament) could be proven or disproven in a court of law, He would then cease to be the Great I Am, The Great Transcedent God of the Universe. If by science and discovery man could answer these questions, the True God would cease to be High and Lofty. These proof/disproof excercises only verify His truth by the very nature in which they are trying to be proved or disproved. There is no conclusive proof, neither is there conclusive dispoof, nor will there ever be. The fact that there is an inconclusive scientific controversy leads me to believe we are on to something. God in not knowable by our discovery, he is only knowable by revelation. For true Christians know that, "Without faith it is impossible to please Him." But I find it very interesting that the controversies are almost completely Biblical prophesies. Where there is smoke there is fire. Notice what religions fail to have these bold, pre-written controversies. Where are those prophesies? Where there is no smoke there is no fire?

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John Bacon Jr — Wed, 19 Nov 2008 01:58:22 GMT

As A Christian this has no bearing on my faith, but I still think its neat when something like this comes along and confirms the Bible

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todd HB — Wed, 19 Nov 2008 02:59:54 GMT

prophesies aren't a suprise to Christians, read Isaiah 53 or Daniel 9:24-27. Daniel ch.9 prophesies the exact day the messiah would declare himself to be the messiah and he would be cut off. There is still one 7 year period in the prophecy that has yet to be fulfilled and based on current world events that time is coming soon! It started with Israel re-emerging as a nation.

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Joe Johnson, Gardez AFG — Wed, 19 Nov 2008 03:22:37 GMT

ALCON,
I would like to know the answer to these questions before I weight in with other questions.
1.When did the Hebrew become a Jew?
2. When did a Yahwehist become a Christian? He whom you all know as Jesus was not a christian.He came in the name of Yahweh.
3. If Yahweh is the divine name of the creator of the gods and goddess and Yahshua is the divine name of his beloved son, then why are these names not used by the so called religiously educated?

Messianic message stirs debate

Willie, Creswell, Oregon — Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:04:17 GMT

In 1974, I met a computer programmer. When I learned of his skill, I became excited and predicted that someday a computer would be unbeatable in chess and would be able to create pseudo-"live reality" television (like Walter Cronkite saying something impossible for example). The first is true now, the second is around the corner. He scoffed at me and said it would never happen because the "code" couldn't be written. Therein is the problem with science in the minds of miserably puny humans. All creation literally CRIES OUT with a LOUD VOICE about their Creator. This is true: humans cannot create beauty. Ask why.

Messianic message stirs debate

Jill Mullin in Kansas — Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:47:49 GMT

I, who have called myself atheist before (half-heartedly), have found that my shaky faith in the Lord has been confirmed through these archeological findings. My biggest regret, though, is that I had to read objective, scientific, and quantifiable findings to strengthen my beliefs. Because I've come to believe strongly only after seeing the evidence, then I guess that my faith isn't really "faith". I've just decided that, while I may not be able to fully know or understand God in my life, I'm going to have to learn how to enjoy that not knowing everything, not having everything proven, knowing that there is always a chance of something far greater and more profound existing that I can't even imagine it now, while I'm in this life on the earth . I don't and can't know it all, and I'm going to have to learn to like that.

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WebSpeak Ezine, Grandview, MO. — Wed, 19 Nov 2008 19:57:35 GMT

Jesus Jewish? Ask a Jewish scholar if the Jews at Jesus' time had a habit of calling non-Jewish people rabbi. Then read the new testament and ask yourself, why did the diciples, who were Jewish, call Jesus rabbi? Must have been a good reason.

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Jay, Fort Riley, KS — Fri, 16 Jan 2009 03:56:38 GMT

The Egyptian book of the dead has many similar prophecies about Horus. If the Jewish community at that time was enslaved, it's possible that they adopted portions of the belief system of the Egyptians. Memetics die hard.

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Jay, Fort Riley, KS — Fri, 16 Jan 2009 03:59:29 GMT

Also, the translation is just a bunch of gibberish. I am sure Christians will somehow interpret into something that validates intelligent design somehow. That is all gibberish as well, so it fits.

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john North Vernon,IN — Mon, 09 Feb 2009 16:35:23 GMT

If only they could find Pandora's box next,so they could prove Jesus had a father named Pandora and put a stop to all this nonsense of invisible "gods" and his return to earth.That would not set a plague upon the earth but upon the church

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Tim Marklinger,Saskatune,Saskwatchewan,Canaduh — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 00:47:00 GMT

Lots of prophecies,and people gifted with a sense.We're in it together,if we have relation with 'him'.He's still the greatest life teacher there was.Maybe someday.Maybe Someday.

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Stephen James, Toledo, Ohio — Mon, 25 May 2009 14:03:25 GMT

A liitle over one third of the Bible is prophecy.The fact that 100's of prophecies have been fufilled thus far demonstrates the accuracy and precise nature of God's Holy Word.

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SEK, Kelso, Missouri — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 15:35:23 GMT

This find if authentic, is somewhat important, but not in any way revolutionary. Read Isaiah 52:13-- 53:12, and you will find something much more interesting about a suffering servant, with very intriguing connections to belief in Christ, than anything in this find. And guess what, its already in the Bible!

Messianic message stirs debate

Kathryn Keziah, Daytona Beach, FL — Wed, 08 Jul 2009 18:50:20 GMT

If you would like to have a different point of view on the Bible, take a look at "Don't Know Much about the Bible". It is written by a Harvard scholor and cited with many references to several different religious authorities. There is reference to the "messiah" stories from Isaiah that show that he was not refering to the coming of Jesus, but to another birth of another Jewish King and to the rebuilding of Judea after a time of exile.
Also the gospels should not be referenced with the idea in mind that they are the direct words of Jesus since the authors of the books were writing these in the time long after the death of Jesus and contain information gleamed from other sources in an attempt to persuade the public that Jesus was the messiah they were looking for. There is no proof written or otherwise that contains the birth records of Jesus or to substantiate any of the other information concerning the birthplace. In fact, scholors have determined that the name "Jesus" is a mistake in translation of the name Yeshua (joshua). So with so many uncertainities surrounding the "facts", it does take faith to believe. Written history has often been bent to serve the needs of the people at the time it was written.

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william yates san diego — Thu, 09 Jul 2009 11:26:59 GMT

there is an antireligious nut born daily,inspired by demons to slander holy truth,,,he dont know we are to listen,to ephesians ch4v11,he thinks science is his god,,,he is sure the universe is 13.7 billion lightyears old,,,100 years ago,astronomers,proved the universe,to be 2 billion years old,a new theory,3 billion,then old theory dies,4 bil,then 5,6,bil,7bil,8bil,9bil,10bil,11billion,12bil,13,14,15,16,17,18bil,19bil,20bil,22bil,40bil, 100 billion, year old universe theories,all mathematical theories, astronomy is mathematics,or nothing.GOD never had a theory,GOD has the total truth,yesterday,today,forever,,GOD never had a hypothesis,or supposition,never an educated guess,he is WONDERFUL COUNSELOR,the EVERLASTING FATHER,MIGHTY GOD,lets us always bow before him,change the world

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JR Jake, Florida — Fri, 04 Sep 2009 02:33:42 GMT

This is great. Excellent article and I await more info in the future. That is a sizeable piece of rock and would have been easy to move from one site to another. If you know of where Jesus lived, the tomb or rocks in and around Jerusalem, Samaria or Galilee, I believe they can find the donor site from where that rock came from. This is way cool.

Messianic message stirs debate

Nicholas Johnson, Phoenix, Arizona — Fri, 04 Sep 2009 07:04:05 GMT

The "Bible," and all respective writings, were developed by a group of people that could've very easily been seen now, as the "Government" of their time. It's interesting that every ten years or so something else is discovered that would make people, with less faith than others, question what they determine to be fact from fiction. Just as is with every aspect in human nature, all religion is just another form of control, proven effective time and time again. Look deep within yourself, not others, to help you along this great journey called Life.

Messianic message stirs debate

Adel, Alpharetta Georgia — Fri, 04 Sep 2009 08:21:27 GMT

First Jesus is a greek translation of the name Yeshua. Yeshua was the man's name while he was here on earth. The tablet is not that important, although it is an intresting find. But all anyone needs to do is take a bible and start looking at what it says and compared to the culture and the time it was written in. Not the past thousand years of "this is what we are telling you it means." I mean ACTUALLY STUDY AND LEARN! All the instructions "law" G-d gave in the Tanak "Old Testoment", believe it or not, are repeated in the Brit Chadasha. Which is correctly translated to the "Renewed" Covanat. Chrisitians are cousins to the Jews. They are graphed onto the tree of life. It all up to how deep do you want to go. The Messiah said "I did not come to change or abolish the Torah, only to make more fulfilled." He tought from both schools of Jewish thought: Letter of the law v/s spirit of the law. And he tought that both were correct.

Messianic message stirs debate

Gary — Fri, 04 Sep 2009 09:58:55 GMT

Just think what a world without politicians will be like.

Messianic message stirs debate

James Basil Dickinson — Fri, 04 Sep 2009 21:28:43 GMT

There are refrences in the Holy Bible of Jesus The Christ, and there are the imposters that came right along with Him. Some before and a lot since! In Christ, we Get a new begining, (THE BORN AGAIN EXPIRENCE)The imposters , you get nothing! The Church is full of imposters, they are in the church (building)but the real deal will get you in the Church TRIUMPHANT, those who are right with with God, those who are "SAVED TO SIN NO MORE" those that would rather be fed to the lions than sin! those who even now are loosing their lives for serving Jesus!

Messianic message stirs debate

Mathew,Indianapolis, Indiana — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 19:49:09 GMT

religion is nothing more than mans greatest invention/creation...

Messianic message stirs debate

Cole, Woodstock Ga — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 21:29:53 GMT

Okay..so I'm not understanding the problem? how would a pre-prophecy of a savior who is crucified, dies and rises 3 days later a problem for christianity? we already know that many of the Jewish community were seeking a messiah..it had been foretold for years..and then you have the prophecy of it happening..before it happens..why would that be a problem on a religious perspective? the prophecy would have to come before the actual doing, thats why its called Prophecy!

Messianic message stirs debate

tjaard,pretoria south africa — Tue, 10 Nov 2009 07:56:01 GMT

search and u will find me....the wisdom of humans is coming to an end and the mysteries of God will be discovered.a theory is just that it ain't fact but everything about Jesus can be proven.if u kick long enough against a stone your body will ignore the pain after a while and this is what people have been doing ignoring the truth.